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[32-3] Just braggin' up my dodger [and jackline solutions]

Geoff W.

Makes Up For It With Enthusiasm
Blogs Author
No real need for this post other than I'm excited about the new Iverson dodger that just got installed today on Delightful. Cost a few boat bucks, but for all the off-season cruising we do, I think it'll pay for itself in happiness points.

AND I can see through it, which is a first.

IMG_0740.JPG
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Gaviate

Member III
Gorgeous I'd say...I've also been pining for some weather protection but many other items to tackle 1st. Looking at your pics, am I correct to see that your mainsheet travels forward to the mast then returns to cockpit on starboard? Aboard my 27, I also have mainsheet atop companionway and could never work out what would happen with a dodger in the way!
 

Nick J

Sustaining Member
Moderator
Blogs Author
Congrats Geoff! Iverson makes the best dodgers out there and it's really cool to see one on an ericson. Thanks for sharing
 

Geoff W.

Makes Up For It With Enthusiasm
Blogs Author
Gorgeous I'd say...I've also been pining for some weather protection but many other items to tackle 1st. Looking at your pics, am I correct to see that your mainsheet travels forward to the mast then returns to cockpit on starboard? Aboard my 27, I also have mainsheet atop companionway and could never work out what would happen with a dodger in the way!

Yes, the mainsheet on my boat travels forward through deck organizer, turning block, and back along the boom before it gets to the traveler tackle.

And thanks all for the kind words! I'm excited to get it out there in some conditions and see how it does!
 

Kenneth K

1985 32-3, Puget Sound
Blogs Author
That's a really great Dodger with that concave /convex top. I figure I can get about 2 years more out of mine, then I need a replacement. I really like the wraparound glass, instead of the old flat panels.
 

goldenstate

Sustaining Member
Blogs Author
Looks great and I like the grab rail at the trailing upper edge. My frame is identical save for this grab-rail feature and I find myself occasionally wishing I had that hand-hold.

Let me know if you devise clever routing for safety jacklines between the cockpit and the foredeck.
The dodger complicates jacklines somewhat, though I too am a big fan of having the structure for protection for the cockpit.
 

Geoff W.

Makes Up For It With Enthusiasm
Blogs Author
I might consider either of these two places. On one hand the back one would mean you wouldn't have to clip/unclip, but then the jacklines run against the portlights, which isn't a deal breaker but isn't sexy and clean. Attaching them ahead from the grab rail would mean an untethered trip from the cockpit to the side, but I would think the grab rails on the dodger would help you keep three points of contact. I'll have to mess around with it on the boat some time.

1611683213405.png
 

Christian Williams

E381 - Los Angeles
Senior Moderator
Blogs Author
The cabin house side isn't right for a jackline because the tether would put the crewman too far down in the water (it's too far outboard). And in the illustration, probably too far aft for self-recovery. We don't want to drag behind the boat.

A jackline needs to be near the centerline of the boat, and is only used for going forward. Work around the cockpit area is better served by a strongpoint in the cockpit for the attachment of the tether there.

I believe the jackline rig should never suspend the wearer below chest level at the gunwale. A six-foot tether doubled to three feet, combined with the stretch of the jackline, provides that. From such a position, if tossed overboard, the victim finds himself with the dual wires of the lifelines in his face, and can pull or swing himself up on deck again. This presumes being thrown overboard over the top of the lifelines, which is likely. Some folks install netting to prevent being washed under the lifelines, but the odds are against that I figure.

The centerline-jackline rule is widely accepted as necessary. The rest of it is thinking it through for oneself. It is not defensible to go forward in heavy air without a jackline system. Sticking your crew with the job of heading back to pick you up, and their ruined lives if they don't succeed, is untenable.

Note: I don't have a dodger, but I do keep two tethers installed. One is for the cockpit, one is for the jacklines. To go forward, change tethers before leaving the cockpit. Maybe a version of that that would work to get around the interruption of the jackline by the dodger. And of course none of it is necessary on a daysail in 10 knots.
 
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goldenstate

Sustaining Member
Blogs Author
The cabin house side isn't right for a jackline because the tether would put the crewman too far down in the water (it's too far outboard). And in the illustration, probably too far aft for self-recovery. We don't want to drag behind the boat.

A jackline needs to be near the centerline of the boat, and is only used for going forward. Work around the cockpit area is better served by a strongpoint in the cockpit for the attachment of the tether there.

I believe the jackline rig should never suspend the wearer below chest level at the gunwale. A six-foot tether doubled to three feet, combined with the stretch of the jackline, provides that. From such a position, if tossed overboard, the victim finds himself with the dual wires of the lifelines in his face, and can pull or swing himself up on deck again. This presumes being thrown overboard over the top of the lifelines, which is likely. Some folks install netting to prevent being washed under the lifelines, but the odds are against that I figure.

The centerline-jackline rule is widely accepted as necessary. The rest of it is thinking it through for oneself. It is not defensible to go forward in heavy air without a jackline system. Sticking your crew with the job of heading back to pick you up, and their ruined lives if they don't succeed, is untenable.

Note: I don't have a dodger, but I do keep two tethers installed. One is for the cockpit, one is for the jacklines. To go forward, change tethers before leaving the cockpit. Maybe a version of that that would work to get around the interruption of the jackline by the dodger. And of course none of it is necessary on a daysail in 10 knots.
I appreciate your response here as I have been wondering about this.

I apologize for hijacking Geoff's thread, but In your video about jacklines and the-skipper-not-falling-off-the-boat, Christian:


I had thought that given the stretch of the jacklines, you would wind up with your shoulders well below the gunwale. It seems like one's worst case in this regard would be to get washed under the lifelines and then be dangling. It would be extremely difficult to climb back on the board if one was all the way in the water, being pulled along at 6 knots. If the intent is to keep the shoulders as high as the toe-rail, that makes a lot more sense.

One could velcro up webbing ladders on one or more stanchions on each side, but unless you fall just forward of such an assist ladder, the climb might be extremely difficult.
 

Christian Williams

E381 - Los Angeles
Senior Moderator
Blogs Author
Many people disagree with my analysis and sometimes in impolite language. But I have found, in bathing suit tests, that if I can grab the gunwale, I can grab the first lifeline wire, and then the second. And then swing a foot up.

Everything's compromise. My system would work better if the jackline were actually on the centerline, but the connections become awkward.
 

nquigley

Sustaining Member
I might consider either of these two places. On one hand the back one would mean you wouldn't have to clip/unclip, but then the jacklines run against the portlights, which isn't a deal breaker but isn't sexy and clean. Attaching them ahead from the grab rail would mean an untethered trip from the cockpit to the side, but I would think the grab rails on the dodger would help you keep three points of contact. I'll have to mess around with it on the boat some time.
What if you run the jackline under the dodger where the handrail goes under it and terminate it on the coachroof under the dodger, outboard of the winches. Then, attach one part of a double-tether harness to the end of the jackline, step out to the side deck and attach the other tether to the jackline on top of the cabin, then, reach back around the dodger to unclip the initial part of the tether - I can't tell from the dodger's geometry just how long the two tethers would have to be though ...
 

goldenstate

Sustaining Member
Blogs Author
What if you run the jackline under the dodger where the handrail goes under it and terminate it on the coachroof under the dodger, outboard of the winches. Then, attach one part of a double-tether harness to the end of the jackline, step out to the side deck and attach the other tether to the jackline on top of the cabin, then, reach back around the dodger to unclip the initial part of the tether - I can't tell from the dodger's geometry just how long the two tethers would have to be though ...
I have thought about that too, though the risk is that if the process is too inconvenient, it may be ignored under duress or under a lack of duress. It is also difficult to reach around to unclip the aft tether, as you mention.

The handle that runs along the upper side edge of the dodger is the most-used hand-hold on the boat for me. The process for me might might be:

Cockpit: Hard point + tether
Beside dodger: Dodger rail grab
Forward of Dodger: Tethered to Jackline
 

Christian Williams

E381 - Los Angeles
Senior Moderator
Blogs Author
If possible, locate the hard point in the cockpit such that the cockpit tether will reach the entire working area of the transom (for adjustment of the wind vane)-- and will also reach the end of the separate tether on the jackline just forward of the dodger. That way, when switching tethers, there is no moment when not connected to one of them. Sounds anal, but the transition from cockpit to deck gets hairy in breaking seas at night.

The separate cockpit tether can be as long as necessary--although 6' works on my boat. Put the hard point within reach of the ladder, so you can hook up or unhook by reaching out from the comfort of the cabin. (Usually I unhook from the harness only after arriving below, and leave the tether hanging in the companionway ready for the next time).

However, the separate jackline tether should be 6' max, which when doubled around the jackline is only 3.' That's long enough for most deck work since the jackline rises and stretches some.

The system has to keep you from dragging in the water too low to pull yourself back on board, but also allow you to do all the work commonly encountered on the foredeck. Test everything and know the compromises.

This is offshore singlehanded stuff, and obviously overkill for daysailing. But it is a great comfort to know you can work any part of the boat in any conditions, and confidence is the antidote to fear and hesitation.
 

Nick J

Sustaining Member
Moderator
Blogs Author
Maybe you can make tethers with a ring between the hooks that is too small fore the hoods to slide through. Then run the jack line through the ring and stow one of the hooks next to the side of the dodger. When you first transfer from the cockpit tether to the jack line tether you would be protected by the opposite hook not passing through the ring on the jack line. when you move to the front of the dodger, you could double up by attaching to the other hook which would shorten it to 3'.
 

Gaviate

Member III
Jack lines are on this season's prep list but I haven't decided which, cable or flat webbing. Interested to hear preferences from seasoned users. I have 0 experience with them. I envision one port and one starboard to get past the mast, or should I just pick a side and only use that tor going forward? As Christian suggests, placement will be as near center as possible.
 

Christian Williams

E381 - Los Angeles
Senior Moderator
Blogs Author
The general thinking is flat tape is the best jackline, WM sells it. Wire or rope rolls under foot.

One jackline would work if you could really put it on centerline. But that's hard to do with a sliding hatch in the way.
 
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