38-200 Post base in cabin?

David Grimm

E38-200
This never looked right to me since I purchased the boat. It doesn't seem to be a problem. The wood base is rock solid but doesn't look good. I was thinking of replacing it with a chunk of SS or Aluminum. Is this a compression post? From what I have seen in pictures the 38-1 doesn't have one. The PO said the wood base was part of the original sole that the installer worked around. Idk? Any suggestions?

Dave
 

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u079721

Contributing Partner
Well I can't provide a photo anymore, but I'm positive that on my '89 model that pole was fastened directly to the thick mast plate you can see supporting the mast and spanning those three "stringers". My understanding was that the function of the pole was to hold the cabin roof down, and resist the tendency to bow up under the compression of the shrouds on the sides of the cabin.
 

Loren Beach

O34 - Portland, OR
Senior Moderator
Blogs Author
Well I can't provide a photo anymore, but I'm positive that on my '89 model that pole was fastened directly to the thick mast plate you can see supporting the mast and spanning those three "stringers". My understanding was that the function of the pole was to hold the cabin roof down, and resist the tendency to bow up under the compression of the shrouds on the sides of the cabin.
Hold the cabin top down, yes. But not having to do with shrouds... Rather to hold it down against the up-force from heavily loaded blocks all-around the mast collar. On a windy day with the vang, main, jib, and spinnaker halyards there is a substantial lifting force on the collar which is bolted down to the cabin top. In turn the cabin top itself needs to be held in place. Our model has a short piece of rigging wire and a turn buckle on the inside, tying the cabin top to the spar.
Trivia: C&C used to use a SS pin that went right thru the spar and the aluminum casting that they shackled the turning blocks to. Worked OK, but also led to lots of corrosion where the SS rod ran thru the alum. casting and the alum. spar.
 

David Grimm

E38-200
Maybe I should pull the wood out and pull the post down to the metal base and screw it in? I can get someone heavy to stand on deck and rig a come along up the the pole inside. Definitely will wait till it gets warmer!
 

goldenstate

Sustaining Member
Blogs Author
You could stack some G10 plates in there and they would never break or degrade or rust etc..


Could this be related to the 'subsidence' issue that some other 38 owners discussed recently?
If the floor flexed away 1/4" one would want some sort of spacer to fill the gap.
 

David Grimm

E38-200
Hmm. I don't have any compression under that heavy mast plate. I never saw the original floor. Very intresting. I wonder if it just pulled out on the po one day or if it was while they were doing the floor. The screws holding it to the plate look very old.
 

goldenstate

Sustaining Member
Blogs Author
Hmm. I don't have any compression under that heavy mast plate. I never saw the original floor. Very intresting. I wonder if it just pulled out on the po one day or if it was while they were doing the floor. The screws holding it to the plate look very old.
My read of the photos is that your post is being held above the floor/sole level. Your post didn't change length, so there should be some reason why it is floating above the sole. In any case, getting someone to stand on the deck to correct the gap seems like a recipe to have screws pull out on you later. I would replace the plate with something that won't degrade.
 

Christian Williams

E381 - Los Angeles
Senior Moderator
Blogs Author
Something's weird. Is that the original equipment table base?

Looks like maybe it's supposed to bolt into the aluminum plate beneath.

Other Ericsons just screw a larger table base to the sole, but it seems your sole has a joint there.
 

Kenneth K

Contributing Partner
Blogs Author
I would say it doesn't matter what, if anything, is under the pole, only that the pole is firmly bolted into in the aluminum base of the mast step. The bolts need to pull/tension the pole downward (to resist all the upward forces on the cabin top from the lines attached to the mast collar). Building too high a base under the flange would prevent the bolts from doing that.

The 32-3 uses a turnbuckle in this area to achieve the required downward tension:

20190221_145055.jpg
 

David Grimm

E38-200
Something's weird. Is that the original equipment table base?

Looks like maybe it's supposed to bolt into the aluminum plate beneath.

Other Ericsons just screw a larger table base to the sole, but it seems your sole has a joint there.
It is not the original table. I'm not sure why. good eye Christian!
 

u079721

Contributing Partner
Hold the cabin top down, yes. But not having to do with shrouds... Rather to hold it down against the up-force from heavily loaded blocks all-around the mast collar. On a windy day with the vang, main, jib, and spinnaker halyards there is a substantial lifting force on the collar which is bolted down to the cabin top. In turn the cabin top itself needs to be held in place. Our model has a short piece of rigging wire and a turn buckle on the inside, tying the cabin top to the spar.
Well......I guess I was sort of right. ; )

Tom above asked if this could be the result of the subsidence that some of us with 38s have seen. I guess it could, but that looks like a really big drop - what is the height of that wood pad, like 2" or so? That would be a lot of subsidence, and mine was probably half that much. And I'd expect there to be other evidence on the cabinetry and cabin sole if the center of the boat had sagged that much.
 
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driftless

Member II
Blogs Author
On my boat the base of the post is anchored to the mast step plate, as others have said, but there is then a wooden block/spacer/shim at the top, between the post and the underside of the deck. The bolts to the top plate on top of the deck run through the wood shim to the post, and tie it all together.

Looks to me like your post is upside down.

Your floor boards also look different from mine. I have removable panels that completely encircle the mast, not just on one side.
 
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Christian Williams

E381 - Los Angeles
Senior Moderator
Blogs Author
That explains the 38-200 design. And gee, upsidedown? Sounds right.

So just replacing the spacer block would work --and getting it the correct height for the current floor boards. Unless of course the machine screws are frozen, which might be why the original block was left unchanged.

It might also be possible to just buy a new table base of larger size, remove the block, and screw the base to sole. There are lots of bases available. Ericson used Zwaardvis pedestals in the mid-1980s.
 
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u079721

Contributing Partner
I guess I'm confused here, but where does the table or table base fit into all this? That pole in David's photo looks like the support rod forward of the mast on the 38-200, meant to hold the deck down - not the table support. (Here's a photo of it on Rag Doll.)
 

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David Grimm

E38-200
The petrified wood is about 1-3/4 inches high. Looking from on deck and below it's hard to imagine that much movement supposing the pole at one point was fixed directly to the mast plate. Think I should try and get it apart and see what happens? Could go up or down. If it stays the same I'll just make an aluminum spacer.

Also there is no table post. The table frame is attached to the mast with a removal wedge type bracket.
 

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