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Delaminating E38 rudder skin?

rwthomas1

Sustaining Partner
Hello All,
Currently stripping the bottom on my E38 and was working on the rudder today. I noticed that there is a section, maybe 18" long (vertically) and 12" wide on one side of the rudder that "bounces" when you push on it? The shape of the area is elliptical and when I tap on the area it is quite obvious where the skin is detached from the inner foam in this area. The rest of the rudder sounds out nicely when tapped with a small mallet.

I am thinking that the repair would be injecting epoxy resin, slightly thickened into a hole drilled at the bottom of this area, filling until it comes out a hole at drilled at the top of this area. What do you think? Would that work?

TIA, RT
 

Cory B

Sustaining Member
Injecting Epoxy would probably work fine.

Our rudder had severe delamination on one side (how did the surveyor miss that one???). We were a little overwhelmed with other projects, so we let the yard take care of this. They felt the delaminated area was too large for the inject epoxy method, so they took off about 50% of the glass on the bad side, and reglassed it (feathering the new glass in, etc.). The rudder came out very fair.

Fortunately, Ericson used quality foam in the rudder and it was still holding together strongly - a headache avoided.

When we hauled out last month the repair still looked solid.
 

Kerry Kukucha

Member II
Cut up rudder

Rob:

Just finished dropping my rudder & removing the post - see attached pictures, including the rudder after it was cut up, which shows delamination & void. I am planning to send the post off to Foss (the original manufacturer) & the expected price of a new rudder, using the original post should be under $1,000 (double if a new post is required). The alternative was to have the fairing guy at our marina cut & rebuild the delaminated side & build out the other side to balance - expected price would have been 2-3x!

Interesting to note, there was a bunch of water inside the rudder (+/- a gallon) & the foam core was pretty wet, although still very solid.

good luck!
 

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rwthomas1

Sustaining Partner
Wow, that is a pretty big void! The area on my rudder only deflects 1/8" or so. As long as there is no water I think I will go the inject resin route. If there is water the Foss price is reasonable so maybe they will be doing TWO E38's this month.... RT
 

rwthomas1

Sustaining Partner
Well, the rudder is wet! I drilled the rudder today and water is dripping out. The next call was to Foss Foam, the rudder will be dropped tomorrow and hopefully shipped out by the end of the week.

Hey Kerry, maybe we can get a discount for two of them?

RT
 

rwthomas1

Sustaining Partner
Hahahaha! Hey John, good to hear from you! Hows the rebuild going? I cut the bottom of my rudder off this evening, just like Kerry's and dropped it out of the boat. Crating tomorrow and off to Foss when they issue a pickup call. Hopefully the turnaround is quick.

FWIW, the foam was very dense still but quite waterlogged at the bottom and around the post area. I am guessing the water was entering at the post/fiberglass union and just running down inside. The delaminated area was larger than expected. I think I made the correct decision on this one. Fingers are crossed that the metal is reuseable to keep cost reasonable.

RT
 

rwthomas1

Sustaining Partner
Thats alright Kerry, I'll be dead last on this one probably. The shipper should pick up Friday at the latest but since you are on the West coast already I think you have me beat easily. JohnK may have us both beat, he just orders his! No rebuilding for him. I'm just hoping for a quick turnaround. RT
 

Kerry Kukucha

Member II
New Rudder is on!

Hello All:

Update on another mission, successfully completed!

Drove south of the border to Fedex's ground shipment facility last Thursday to pick up the new rudder from Foss/Finco (saved a few days delivery time not having to use a customs broker). For a 20 year old boat, there was little or no play in the post, so didn't have to shim; the flange packing was also in very good condition so just applied anti-fouling paint, greesed up the post, lubricated the quadrant moving parts & re-installed it without a hitch!

We were sailing by Saturday for our Victoria Day long weekend & what a difference - steering was effortless in the 15 -20 knot winds we encountered (the old rudder, which was somewhat water logged & had developed a noticable wave where the glass had delaminated from the foam core, was a bit uncomfortable to steer - there was a constant push/oscilation, probably from the flow of water over uneven surfaces).

Foss delivered as agreed & within a couple of weeks of getting our original post - all in all, a satisfactory resolution!
 

rwthomas1

Sustaining Partner
Glad to hear it worked out for you Kerry! I spoke to Foss today and they said mine would be done next week and then with any luck arrive the following week. I was really hoping to get the boat in for this weekend, or maybe the week after. Our season is too damned short for delays like this! Foss is a bit over their stated lead time, which is annoying but I am getting the feeling that is the way of things in the marine industry. Can't hide my type A, ex-corporate, Yankee expectations I guess.....;) I've still got work to do so now I have the time to do it. RT
 

rwthomas1

Sustaining Partner
Right now I'm about to blow my stack. I can't deal with the BS anymore. My rudder was shipped to Foss on April 28. Foss flatly stated, no problem 1-2 week turnaround, tops. I still don't have my rudder. I have been told, FOUR TIMES, that it is in various stages and "almost ready to ship". On 5/30 Foss told my wife that it was "being crated" and would be ready to go on 6/2. No word yesterday, Foss needs a credit card number to charge and was supposed to call. Today my wife is told that "it should be ready to go on Wed or Thur" Yeah right, and pigs will fly.

I run my own business. When I tell you something you can believe it, down to the day and sometimes even the hour. I feel I am being lied to and that just flat enrages me. I understand delays. I understand problems. What I don't understand is not being truthful with a customer. If the lead time was closer to 4 weeks, then simply tell me that. If you have a delay/problem, etc. then tell me that. Don't just keep leading me on. When and if I get the rudder back it will be the last time I do business with Foss.

My yard has had me scheduled to launch and moved back on the list multiple times now. My boat is in their way. They have been quite polite about it but I am quite sure they would like a realistic launch date so if they need to move me they would. So the delays have spilled over to their operations too.

My season is now almost half gone.

RT
 
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