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e38 Shaft Tube Size?

atomic2797

Member I
I'm replacing my PYI PSS dripless shaft seal on my '88 38-200. Does anyone know the shaft tube size? I talked to PYI and they dont keep a database of boats and sizes (which is a little rediculous if you ask me).
 

Afrakes

Sustaining Member
How are they supposed to know what any boat owner has done to their boat's drive train. Folks modify their boats all the time. You own the boat, you should know. Said as gently as I could.
 

atomic2797

Member I
How are they supposed to know what any boat owner has done to their boat's drive train. Folks modify their boats all the time. You own the boat, you should know. Said as gently as I could.
I dont expect a manufacturer to know about modifications obviously, but factory stock sizes for a company that specializes in a particular product in a particular industry? I know when i call up North Sails and tell them what boat i have, they know EXACTLY what the dimensions and spars are that came with the boat. Or a mechanic knows exactly what water pump i need for my Universal M40.

This is a forum to be able to ask questions from the community, not criticize people for doing so. Said as gently as I could.
 

nquigley

Sustaining Member
Good luck with the shaft seal replacement.
Just wondering - if you have to do this seal replacement during a haul-out - will you have to pull the shaft (at least partly) out?
Do you know if you can do that without dropping your rudder? (might be a consideration for how you get set up on the hard?)

Presumably you don't have the OEM Manual for the boat - the prop shaft spec is in my manual.
Do you have access to your boat? Even if you find the OEM spec, you probably want to put a caliper across your actual shaft just to make sure before ordering parts that may differ according to that measurement.
FWI, my shaft (OEM and actual) is 1'' diameter). But my M25 engine is smaller than yours - your shaft will be at least 1" diam, and may be the next size up (?)
 

Loren Beach

O34 - Portland, OR
Senior Moderator
Blogs Author
Ahem. The point is valid, from both viewpoints, but...........

The E-38 hull was in production from 1979 to 1990 by EY, and then in further limited production by PSC until about 1998.
My unscientific guess is that the shaft log molded tube may -- or may not -- have been the same. :(

I am 97.4 % sure that a builder molds out those parts in bunches at a time, in various diameters, for their boats. Since the shaft OD was likely the same for the whole production run, the FRP log was kind of likely the same, too, for a given model.

However... (!) the layup schedule may well have changed over time by a layer of cloth or two, and so the OD will have changed slighly.
Fact is, most of us have little acquaintance with this part of the boat's running gear. It's fricken difficult to access, and the degree of "fricken-ness" varies from one model to another.

I have not personally accessed this part of an E-38, but have a lot of experience in my 34. Even with the contortion to get both hands near the shaft log, it is challenging to mic it for OD. I went thru this in the 90's when installing a PSS shaft seal. That frp tube is a bit lumpy on the outside, which adds spice to your measurements/accuracy.

My point, and I do have one, is that every individual boat will need to have its own "data book", and woefully this is not what the thread starter was hoping to hear. Unfortunate, but way too likely.
I wish it were otherwise.
 

nquigley

Sustaining Member
Good luck with the shaft seal replacement.
Just wondering - if you have to do this seal replacement during a haul-out - will you have to pull the shaft (at least partly) out?
Do you know if you can do that without dropping your rudder? (might be a consideration for how you get set up on the hard?)

Presumably you don't have the OEM Manual for the boat - the prop shaft spec is in my manual.
Do you have access to your boat? Even if you find the OEM spec, you probably want to put a caliper across your actual shaft just to make sure before ordering parts that may differ according to that measurement.
FWI, my shaft (OEM and actual) is 1'' diameter). But my M25 engine is smaller than yours - your shaft will be at least 1" diam, and may be the next size up (?)
Sorry - I misread your question - thought you were wondering about prop shaft.
But, as Loren said - can you reach in there to 'sort-of' measure the diam of the log?
Good luck!
 

atomic2797

Member I
Good luck with the shaft seal replacement.
Just wondering - if you have to do this seal replacement during a haul-out - will you have to pull the shaft (at least partly) out?
Do you know if you can do that without dropping your rudder? (might be a consideration for how you get set up on the hard?)

Presumably you don't have the OEM Manual for the boat - the prop shaft spec is in my manual.
Do you have access to your boat? Even if you find the OEM spec, you probably want to put a caliper across your actual shaft just to make sure before ordering parts that may differ according to that measurement.
FWI, my shaft (OEM and actual) is 1'' diameter). But my M25 engine is smaller than yours - your shaft will be at least 1" diam, and may be the next size up (?)
I'm doing the cutlass bearing too, so the shaft will have to come out. Not sure on rudder removal as this is the first time doing either of these jobs.

The marina I'm in forces you to use a contractor for bottom paint so i'm just going to have them do all 3 jobs. I can always wait till its on the hard to pull the shaft seal. I was just hoping to get a jump on ordering parts to avoid unnecessary lay days.
 

atomic2797

Member I
Loren, all valid points.

When i do finally get this thing out, i'll post my findings here in hopes it helps others doing the same job.
 

nquigley

Sustaining Member
I couldn't find an underwater profile of your boat - here's mine: https://sailboatdata.com/sailboat/ericson-32-3
If your's is similar, you'll also have a pretty close gap between the end of your prop shaft and your rudder.
There's a clever tool some yards will have that can replace cutlass bearings without taking the shaft out, but you do need to get the prop off (of course).
I was out last month and planned to take my prop off - I couldn't even fit my prop-puller (gear-puller style with ~14" central forcing pin) between the prop and the rudder. See pic for reference - my gap is about 8".

IMG_4785.jpg
 

Afrakes

Sustaining Member
I dont expect a manufacturer to know about modifications obviously, but factory stock sizes for a company that specializes in a particular product in a particular industry? I know when i call up North Sails and tell them what boat i have, they know EXACTLY what the dimensions and spars are that came with the boat. Or a mechanic knows exactly what water pump i need for my Universal M40.

This is a forum to be able to ask questions from the community, not criticize people for doing so. Said as gently as I could.
Sorry you took offense. However I think that it is a real basic thing to know about one's boat. Have you checked to see if you have enough room between the shaft log and transmission coupler for the PSS to fit?
 

Christian Williams

E381 - Los Angeles
Senior Moderator
Blogs Author
A reputable sail loft will always measure the spars (published dimensions are only for estimates). Always measure everything, saves a heap o' trouble.
 

driftless

Member III
Blogs Author
Sorry you took offense.
Quite the fauxpology.

Atomic - I don't have a ton of info for you and no firsthand experience, but I do have the E38-200 manual. You should not need to remove the rudder to pull the shaft, as it's at a slight angle and should just clear the rudder (to starboard, which incidentally might also help counteract propwalk to a degree?)
The manual gives the bearing dimensions as 1 1/4" O.D. X 3 7/8" L. for a 1" shaft. 1" monel shaft was the standard. It unfortunately gives no dimensions for the shaft log.
Download the manual here if you haven't already - https://ericsonyachts.org/ie/resources/e38-200-owners-manual-stnd.118/
 

atomic2797

Member I
Quite the fauxpology.

Atomic - I don't have a ton of info for you and no firsthand experience, but I do have the E38-200 manual. You should not need to remove the rudder to pull the shaft, as it's at a slight angle and should just clear the rudder (to starboard, which incidentally might also help counteract propwalk to a degree?)
The manual gives the bearing dimensions as 1 1/4" O.D. X 3 7/8" L. for a 1" shaft. 1" monel shaft was the standard. It unfortunately gives no dimensions for the shaft log.
Download the manual here if you haven't already - https://ericsonyachts.org/ie/resources/e38-200-owners-manual-stnd.118/
great! that should save a little time not having to drop the rudder. sounds like i'll have to pull the old dripless seal and just take a measurement. thanks for the link and info!
 

atomic2797

Member I
Sorry you took offense. However I think that it is a real basic thing to know about one's boat. Have you checked to see if you have enough room between the shaft log and transmission coupler for the PSS to fit?
all good. this is the first time replacing the seal, so once i do the job I'll note the measurements in my maintenance log. the purpose of the post was to see if others had done the job and could provide knowledge. i currently have a PYI dripless seal, just replacing it as its hit the 6 year recommended lifespan.

Also. just FYI to anyone interested, when i spoke with PYI, they DO still make the old style seal without the vent tube but do not market it. They said because of concerns that people do not properly burp them. You also have to order directly through PYI.
 
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