East to West through the Great Lakes —- Lake Champlain to Lake Superior

[Jonbabco]

Boat Move





I am receiving an “84 35’ Mk III located on Lake Champlain, I will be moving it to the Apostle Island area in WI on Lake Superior as soon as school is out in June. I will have about 6 weeks to get the boat ready in NY and move it to WI. Lots of unknowns —- Lots of questions:

Love to here from some one who has made the trip —- I am thinking I have two possible routes but I am unsure if I can do the all water route with only 4 weeks left for boat moving after spending 2 weeks getting the boat ready before departure.
1) The All by water —— Champlain Canal to the Erie Canal into Erie at Buffalo past Detroit to Huron to trough the Souix locks into Lake Superior to Bayfield Wi.

2) By truck and water —— Truck the boat to the eastern end of Georgian Bay then sail the boat through Georgian Bay through the Souix Locks into Superior and on to Bayfield WI

Love to hear from any one who has made the East to West journey —- Especially if during the June-July time period. What are the prevailing winds like? How much motoring should we expect? Are we very likely to experience much sever weather. ETC.

Anything experience you can share would be greatly appreciated including links or references to informative material would be great.

Thanks in advance for any help you can provide

Jon

 

[dhill]

Hi @Jonbabco,

Please see my response on your other thread regarding the trip and preparations. Except for one day, we had excellent weather - we were lucky. There will be a lot of motoring, at least until you get to the lakes, so your engine should be in excellent working order. I put about 80 hours on my engine during my trip from Lake Champlain to Maine.

Here is how I planned my trip, at least down to where the Eric Canal meets with the Hudson River. You will branch off my path at that point.

Day 1 - Shelburne, VT to Whitehall Marina, NY (mast down, motoring), right at entrance to Lock 12 (the first lock going south).
Day 2 - Whitehall Marina, NY to Lock 4 (mast down, motoring). Locks close at 5pm and you can't stop between Lock 3 and Lock 4.
Day 3 - Lock 4 to fork for Erie Canal (IIRC, we passed the Erie Canal entrance at mid-late morning - mast still down).

You should be prepared for alternative scenarios in case there are weather issues (e.g., lightning shuts down the locks), lock malfunction and servicing. Most locks have a place to tie up or enough space to motor around if you need to hang out for a while. A convenient VHF radio at the helm is helpful to notify locks that you are approaching and find out when you can enter. The lock operators are generally very helpful and usually notify the next lock that you are headed their way.

Your mast will need to remain down through the Erie Canal, so a lot more motoring will be needed. Here are some links I found useful.

Navigating the Canals - New York State Canals

www.canals.ny.gov

Champlain Canal - Cruising, Navigation, & Transit Information

Champlain Canal - Canal Cruising Guide - Locks, bridges and vertical clearances, depths, charts, aids to navigation, distances, travel times, and weather.

www.offshoreblue.com

In the natural sections of the Champlain Canal, pay close attention to the markings as it is easy in a couple of spots to get off track and out of the channel.

Despite having to motor all the way down to New York City, I thoroughly enjoyed my trip and your trip should be amazing as well! Lake Champlain is beautiful with 4,000+ foot mountains on both sides. You'll also pass by Fort Ticonderoga and see a little bit of everything along the way.

Enjoy!
Dave

 

[Jerry VB]

You might also consider taking the Trent–Severn Waterway (also Wikipedia) to go between Lake Ontario and Georgian Bay rather than going through Lake Erie. By eyeball, it would cut quite a bit of distance off your trip. Downsides are that it would be all motoring and it requires crossing into Canada.

Canal depths are also of concern. From the Trent-Severn Waterway link: "The Navigation channel runs a depth of six feet from start to finish." Your boat is listed as having 6.17 foot draft.

 

[Jonbabco]

Thanks for the information —- Still wondering if 4 weeks will be enough time to make it by water from Port Henry NY to Bayfield WI especialy if we run in to bad weather or mechanical problems.

 

[dhill]

Thanks for the information —- Still wondering if 4 weeks will be enough time to make it by water from Port Henry NY to Bayfield WI especialy if we run in to bad weather or mechanical problems.

I have not traversed the Erie Canal or sailed the Great Lakes, so take this back of a napkin analysis with a grain of salt.

It would seem to me that 4 weeks is pretty tight timing. It will probably take at least 9 days to get from Port Henry through Lake Champlain, Champlain Canal and the Erie Canal, assuming no lock issues and moving at 6-7 knots. You will need at least half a day to step the mast and get everything reconnected and rigged. From the eastern shores of Lake Erie to the Apostle Islands is about 630 miles - by the crow flies, according to Google Earth. If you are able to navigate the Trent-Savern Waterway, the actual distance may not be that much longer. Very roughly speaking, if you travel 60 miles/day only in daylight (about what I averaged on my trip), you are probably looking at another 12-15 days. That would leave you at just under 4 weeks with only a small number of days leeway for bad weather/conditions/lock issues/boat issues. If you traverse Lake Erie, the distance would be considerably longer.

Navionics has a web app which can allow you to autoroute and plan your trip more precisely with an exact route. You should assume 15-20 minutes at a minimum to traverse each lock. If there is traffic going the other way, it can be 30-40 minutes. You can enter your boat's speed and plan out each day. That will give you a more precise idea of how long it could take under ideal conditions. My trip to Maine ended up taking one day longer than expected (13 vs a planned 12 days due to one day of poor sailing conditions).

Another option, if you don't make it all the way to the Apostle Islands, would be to have a backup plan to leave the boat at a marina along the way during the weekdays and travel the rest of the way on the weekend(s).

It could also take time to get the boat ready for delivery by truck. Everything in the boat will need to be secured. @bgary wrote a great set of five articles on trucking his boat, which I found very helpful when I was considering whether trucking would be a good alternative.

Either way, you will get to know the boat pretty well by the end of the trip. Given the time of year, you may have some time to fully work out the details whichever path you choose to take.

 

[Loren Beach]

One observation from up here in the third balcony: plan on a full day to re-step your double-spreader spar and get sails back on and all of the running rigging figured out. We have about the same rig, and when we launched in April, it took several hours to get under way, and longer to get all of the wiring, boom, and running rig sorted. And this was a boat that I knew pretty well, having owned it since 1994, and installed a new diesel in 2018.
I like the advice you are getting about really having the drive train sorted out first. You will be motoring more in one trip than most of us go in several years. Great adventure (!) , but planning and prep is vital.
All the best,
Loren

 

[LEB]

If you go up the Detroit & St. Clair Rivers be prepared to buck the considerable current under the Blue Water Bridge(s).

 

[Afrakes]

Truck it all the way to its final destination if you can afford it. Look for a deal. Make your life simpler and stress free. Save all of the angst for when you get it in home waters. I trailered an E-28+ from Maine to my home, rogue style. Looking over my shoulder the whole way. Two day trip. One out and one back. Had my present E-28/2 trucked from Quincy, MA to my local marina. Much less stress.

 

[Grizz]

You'll love the Apostle Islands, once you get there and acclimate. We attended a friend's wedding July 4th weekend in Duluth 5 years ago and there were still remnants of big ice chunks floating within eyesight from land. Brrrrrr.

Another observation from the 4th balcony: investigate trucking her to Port Huron, stepping the mast and making the run 'over the top' from Lake Huron, through Sault St. Marie and west to The Apostle Islands in Lake Superior. Or...truck her to Sault St. Marie, step there and enjoy a shakedown cruise to the Apostles sailing 100% in Lake Superior.

As to weather, patterns have changed, nothing is 'normal', but June used to be the beginning of southern warmth intersecting with remaining Canadian cold = wet weather with a chance of mild days with SW wind. Plan for cold, very cold, especially the lakewater temps. Superior is the deepest and the coldest. June 21st remains the longest daylight day, so that hasn't changed!

Sounds like an adventure. Enjoy.

 

[kapnkd]

If you go up the Detroit & St. Clair Rivers be prepared to buck the considerable current under the Blue Water Bridge(s).

Correct!!

…Most locals (my sailing friends) when traversing/bucking the strong currents in that area of the Detroit River - or in general - usually hug one side of the river as the currents aren’t quite as strong along the sides.

Living on and keeping our Ericson at Grosse Ile, MI., which is at the Southern most end of the Detroit River, the current runs steady at an easy 3 knot clip.

In the more narrow regions of the river, like around the “Blue Water Bridge”, it increases significantly proving to be a “PITA” patch of river to get through for us sailors.

Regardless, it is but a small worthwhile price to pay for the incredibly beautiful waters and fantastic cruising opportunities Lake Huron provides on both Michigan and Canadian shores!

 

[kapnkd]

Boat Move





I am receiving an “84 35’ Mk III located on Lake Champlain, I will be moving it to the Apostle Island area in WI on Lake Superior as soon as school is out in June. I will have about 6 weeks to get the boat ready in NY and move it to WI. Lots of unknowns —- Lots of questions:

Love to here from some one who has made the trip —- I am thinking I have two possible routes but I am unsure if I can do the all water route with only 4 weeks left for boat moving after spending 2 weeks getting the boat ready before departure.
1) The All by water —— Champlain Canal to the Erie Canal into Erie at Buffalo past Detroit to Huron to trough the Souix locks into Lake Superior to Bayfield Wi.

2) By truck and water —— Truck the boat to the eastern end of Georgian Bay then sail the boat through Georgian Bay through the Souix Locks into Superior and on to Bayfield WI

Love to hear from any one who has made the East to West journey —- Especially if during the June-July time period. What are the prevailing winds like? How much motoring should we expect? Are we very likely to experience much sever weather. ETC.

Anything experience you can share would be greatly appreciated including links or references to informative material would be great.

Thanks in advance for any help you can provide

Jon

Cruising Food For Thought!
…Do you have or can you get any type of Yacht or Boating Club membership??

Throughout the Great Lakes, various clubs are associated/affiliated, which provide member boaters the ability to visit other clubs on their cruising journeys. (AYC - Affiliated Yacht Clubs) Most offerings are reciprocal - meaning whatever your organization charges others, they in turn charge/offer the same.

Most often your first and even 2nd night stay is for free! Even IF there’s a charge…it’s far from the costs of commercial/public marinas.

Well worth looking into!!!

 

[mordust]

It is my understanding that the Trent-Severn Waterway depth is theoretically maintained to about 6 feet, and if your draft is greater than 5 ft you may not be allowed through or have to sign some kind of waiver.

 

[kapnkd]

It is my understanding that the Trent-Severn Waterway depth is theoretically maintained to about 6 feet, and if your draft is greater than 5 ft you may not be allowed through or have to sign some kind of waiver.

Sorry….Haven’t transversed it, so cannot offer honest - let alone CURRENT advice for you.

FYI - GOOD NEWS - The annual Great Lakes water level/heights have recently been well above normal recorded levels now for the past 3-4 years. It’s simply but an ongoing long term natural cycle - yet, at least - in your favor at this point in time.

Hopefully other locals familiar with that specific area can/will add their more precise information for you!

 

[tenders]

I've taken my boat through the Erie Canal west to east, down the Hudson to NYC. And I'd previously trucked the same boat from San Diego to the Great Lakes. And I've previously sailed a different boat from Traverse City, MI through the Welland Canal to the Finger Lakes (which took 3 weeks). My advice: truck this one and sort everything out about your new boat in your home port. Being on a timeline, unfamiliar with the boat, and unfamiliar with the path you're taking is basically three strikes against success. I'd still suggest the truck solution with only two of those strikes.