Location of battery charger on E32-200?

[Mikebat]

I can't find my battery charger. It isn't in the engine compartment and it isn't behind the electrical panel. The batteries are located under the foot of the bunk in the aft cabin. Outboard to port of the battery compartment is a void with no access opening. Inside the battery compartment is a round access panel which gives access to the backside of the battery switch, but only if the batteries are removed. Looking through this access panel I can see the thick red and black cables from the switch going into the void. I think my charger is in this void, though I can't figure out if this is the factory location or not. It would have had to be installed before the bunk was installed.

The problem I have which makes me want to get at the battery charger is this: when on shore power, I have DC in the cabin for lights, instruments, etc. When disconnected from shore power, I have no DC in the cabin, but I have DC for starting the engine. While connected to shore power, however, I can run DC devices in the cabin, and if I draw a lot of current (stereo cranked loud) eventually the DC in the cabin will shut down. I can watch the battery voltage meters slowly dropping over a few hours until something (the charger I presume) shuts down the power to prevent undervoltage on the batteries. A few hours later, the batteries have recharged from shore, and I can power things from cabin DC again, and the batteries show a full charge, at least while shore power is connected and the charger is turned on. I get nothing if shore power is disconnected, or the charger is turned off. No DC, no voltage reading on the panel meters. I also get nothing when the engine is running and shore power is disconnected, although I have plenty of juice for starting the engine.

So it seems I can only draw power from my batteries when I am connected to shore power and the charger is turned on. If I draw more than the charger can replenish, I can deplete my batteries until I get a low-voltage shutoff. These symptoms all seem to point to the charger as the source or solution to the problem.

Now if only I could find it! The manuals given me by the P.O. say nothing about the charging system, except for a dangling wire diagrammed on the AC electrical drawing, which is labelled "To optional battery charger."

 

[Geoff Johnson]

My battery charger was on the starboard side under the coaming (until I threw it out).

However, I am having trouble making sense of what you are saying. I don't think chargers shut off batteries unless you also have an inverter. In any event you shouldn't be running your batteries below 50% if you want to keep them very long. Moreover, even from a dead battery you are going to get a reading of 11 volts or so. You also seem to be saying that your alternator is connected only to the starting battery. That can't be right. There has to be a battery switch somewhere that will parallel the house and starting batteries.

Maybe someone with a 32-200 can give you a better answer. Good luck.

 

[Loren Beach]

Not to belabor the obvious, but you could either follow the wiring from the back of the AC breaker panel, from the "charger" breaker to the battery...
Or, start at the battery and follow the small wires (should be a #12 or #10) back to the hidden charger.
It seems quite odd for such a device to be hidden. Perhaps the prior owner installed it and only he knows where it is!

Our '88 came with the factory charger installed, and it was easily accessible. It was a ferro-resonant type and regularly murdered the batteries -- I replaced it with a new Statpower 20 charger a decade ago.

Best,
Loren in PDX

 

[Tom Metzger]

Strange

Mike - Look in the sail locker against the forward bulkhead. At least that is where it is on the E-34.

The problems you describe sounds to me like you may have complex DC system with one battery charging off of the other. The engine starts off of a good, charged battery, and the house battery is shot and only provides power when the low current charger is on. The low current charger cannot provide sufficient current for the house bank and shuts down.

Anyone know how an Echo Charger operates?

I strongly recommend someone who would recognize what he is looking at take a look at it your DC wiring.

Good luck.

 

[clayton]

Location of battery charger on E32-200

Mike -
Tom is correct, look in the starboard cockpit locker (under the seat). The battery charger should be mounted on the back of the head compartment bulkhead, above the water heater and holding tank.
Clayton

 

[rotorhead]

Battery charger location.

Hi Mike,
My 38 has the charger located on the starboard locker, close to the water heater...
The idea of following cables is good...if there is a locker on the side of the shore power plug, get in, and try to squeeze your way and follow the cables from the connector; it should eventually reachthe charger....

Make sure you have somebody to keep an eye on you. I have heard stories of people locking themselves in a locker...it gives me the creeps....

Also, don't forget to unplug the shore power....just in case.....120AC and close quarters don't mix too well....

Good hunting..!!!!!!
Ismael
S/V Erica of Falmouth
97 E380 # 24

 

[rssailor]

Battery Problems

I would strongly suggest you have a qualified Marine Electrician come look at your boat to determine what the problem is. Check your lazerette for the charger, thats where it is on E 34's. Good luck. Ryan

 

[Mikebat]

Thanks for the advice. I'll look in the starboard lazarette next time I am at the boat.

To answer Geoff's question, when the power to the cabin shut off I checked the battery voltage meters and they read a little below 12V for both banks. I had a few cabin lights on and had been listening to the CD player for about two hours and it and the lights just shut off. In the dark I couldn't do much so I went to bed. I was staying on the boat that night just to look into the electrical problem (lack of DC cabin power when disconnected from shore) the next day. This was the first time I had seen it shut off like that before. But next morning I had cabin power again, without having touched a thing. This all happened at the dock with shore power connected. I've also put a batery tester on the battery's posts, with the battery switch off, and both had a full charge.

So I guessed that there must be something that shuts off the batteries when they have low voltage. I am also guessing that this thing might be part of the charger. It sure seems that DC is drawn off the batteries through the charger somehow, because if it is turned off, there is no DC. But I don't know if it's the charger, I'm still trying to find all the parts of the electrical system. If I can find the thing, maybe the manufacturer has a user's manual online.

I also wonder if there is a fuse or breaker for DC coming from the batteries into the electrical panel? If there is, I haven't found it on the panel or behind it.

 

[Geoff Johnson]

My guess is that your house batteries are shot and that the DC charger provides only a "surface charge" that makes them appear to be healthy. To really check a battery, you need to load test it, and that is apparently what you are doing with the stereo, and the batteries are failing. The batteries revive briefly in the morning because they have had a chance to bounce back.

 

[u079721]

Ferro-Resonate always bad?

Loren wrote:

"Our '88 came with the factory charger installed, and it was easily accessible. It was a ferro-resonant type and regularly murdered the batteries -- I replaced it with a new Statpower 20 charger a decade ago."

We had the same experience. When we bought the boat the batteries were shot and I had to replace them. But I quickly found that the new batteries were being murdered by the factory installed Ferro-resonate charger. There didn't seem to be any setting that didn't boil the water right out of them on the float. A Statpower 20 solved all that. About the only neat thing about that old charger was that it had non-automatic settings that allowed extra fast charging (at higher voltage) IF you were there to shut it down after a few hours.

Did all of these ferro chargers do that? I thought it was just mine that had gone bad.

 

[Tom Metzger]

Ferro resonant chargers

Ferro resonant chargers usually don't have any controls, and the voltage is dependant on load current. The effect is that if you don't have a frequently recurrent load, such as refrigeration, the batteries will be over charged. This requires that the charger be shut down when not needed, and that the water levels be frequently checked. A PITA if you have flooded cells, or possibly murder if you valve regulated cells (AGM or gel). The good news is that you never have to equalize the batteries.

I did as many do and bought a Statpower 20.

 

[Mikebat]

Yay. Another project, another thing to replace. Boating is a gas.

Looks like they call the Statpower "TRUEcharge 20" these days. Price $298.00, not too bad I guess, in the big scheme of things. I am sure the batteries will be pricey if mine are fried, which it seems that they are.

 

[Tom Metzger]

Relax

Mike - Find your electrical problem before you worry about replacing working equipment. Just check the batteries for water level at least monthly.

 

[Mikebat]

Oh I'm just thinking "out loud", no worries.

 

[stbdtack]

Battery charging...

Hey Mike,
I bought an Iota power supply to use as a charger. Its not "Marine" branded so its less than the boat chargers. I chatted with their engineer and was impressed. They are built as 12volt power supplies so they are free from noise and interference(heart inverters are notorious for this) and provide very clean current. The basic power supply has an add on controller that drives the 4 step charging profile. Its a little 2x2" box that plugs into a phone jack on the charger. You can also get the power supply with the controller built onto the board. They both function the same.

The only caveat is they have a single output (but so do most alternators) I use the battery switch for charging anyway. They are very small and light with a variable speed fan for less noise. I have a 90 amp model which is more than I need but it was the same size as the 75 so i couldnt resist. Mine has worked flawlessly for 2 years and I only have to top up water every 8 months so far(a good indication that its not overcharging) Another cool feature is that it will automatically equalize the batteries every 7 days if the batteries are not being used.

Just saw a new 30 amp model on Ebay for $120 "buy it now" price. (Iota DLS-30)

Anyway just wanted you to know there are less expensive alternatives to pricey marine chargers.....

 

[clohman]

On my '86 32, the battery charger is beneath the starboard locker in the cockpit, mounted just aft of the trash bin that is also accessible from the galley through the swinging door. Check the two 3 position switches on the charger (if yours is so configured) to 1) ensure it is set to the correct type of battery and 2) for the correct temp range.

 

[Mikebat]

I removed the batteries today and turns out they are West Marine brand AGM group 24 batteries the P.O. bought in March 2003. The bad news is that he did not replace the Readi-Amp 8 battery charger. It's in the starboard locker like several people said. I have kept the charger on when the boat is at the dock since I got the boat in January, not knowing any better.

I took the batteries to West Marine but they couldn't do a load test, all they could do is put a meter on the terminals, which I already had done and they seem to be OK from the meter. The green LED for 12.5V lights up. I also see red LEDs on my DC panel light up when I turn on a breaker, but no cabin lights or electrics will turn on. I will see on Monday if Autozone or some other place like that can do a load test on them and find out if they have any capacity remaining after all this.

 

[Mikebat]

Took the batteries to BatteryPlus in Culver City and had them put on a load tester. The test shows the batteries are in perfect condition, and are fully charged. So whatever my problem is, it is not caused by overcharged or damaged batteries. I think I should replace my charger anyway with a modern 3-stage programmed charger, but it won't address the problem at hand so I'll put that on the to-do list next to adding a house battery bank.

So to sum up, my symptoms are as follows:

• No DC in cabin when battery charger is off
• Able to start engine on batteries, with charger off
• When battery charger is off, service light on DC breaker panel is on
• When battery charger is off, turning on a breaker lights the LED, but the lights or radio or pump on that circuit won't turn on.

So it looks like wiring from charger to battery is good, wiring from charger to panel is good, but something is not right with the wiring from the battery to the panel. If I had a short to ground here, there might be enough juice still to light the LED but not to run the device attached to the circuit.

So if I can't solve this problem, anybody have a recommendation for a marine electrician they've hired before?

 

[rssailor]

Wiring troubles

Mike,
Check out the cables from the panel to the battery, both DC + and minus. Use an digital volt meter like a fluke and set it to OHMs. Test the wires and see what kind of resistance you get. Look for loose connections anywhere in the system on the DC side at the batteries and panel/battery switches. Check for any apparent corrosion on the wiring at the batteries and the panel. Check to make sure the DC negative cable on the engine block is tight and not corroded. Good luck. Wish I could help you with a recomendation for a good electrician in you are, but not familiar with that area. Ryan Owner Ryan's Marine Alameda, CA and Ericson 25+ Moonglow

 

[Mikebat]

Found the problem

I located the problem. The ground cable from the panel's negative bus bar to ship's ground had a loose crimp on its ring lug and the cable end had worked loose. The P.O. had covered it up with electrical tape. I replaced it. The bus bar was also somewhat corroded, so I replaced it too and cleaned the spades and rings on the wire ends connected to it. Everything works just fine now.