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Mac Navigation: iPad vs laptop

Loren Beach

O34 - Portland, OR
Senior Moderator
Blogs Author
I am presently moving from an old Mac Book Pro to a new .... Mac Book OR... perhaps... a large iPad with an accessory keyboard. (?)
I liked the navigation application, GPSNavX and the companion MacENC on my present older laptop and home computer. Both of these, actually, are due for replacement.
(The even-older iMac is being replaced soon by a new one with a larger display, FWIW)
I got started with that app on my prior Mac G4 notebook, over several offshore deliveries, and really liked the interface.

Problem is that the maritime navigation market is/has moved from computers to iPad type devices. The authors of my nav app have moved to an iPad OS version and recently ceased providing a current version update for their Mac laptop OS.
I do understand that volume drives the market for this stuff, and starting with their very successful and lauded iPhone nav systems the whole market evolved steadily in that direction.

So I tried to do some keyboarding input on a demo new iPad this weekend at a vendor store, and... while the OS moves like magic lightning using the touch access, the flat keyboard was difficult to use. As in Really Difficult.
Admittedly I am spoiled by having a decent keyboard on my iMac at home and also on my Mac Book.
Lack of access by mouse or trackpad seems problematic, also.

None of my whining diminishes the magic of what the iPadOS can do, and do well.
It does make me ponder this change.

I also would use the replacement "travel computing device" for the usual word processing and web access when traveling on land or sea. Reading ebooks would be nice once in a while, as well.

Googling seems to show only one or two other nav. apps on the market for MacOS, and reviews for some are mixed at best.

Good thing that the boat has a Lowrance plotter at the helm; but I really do like the redundancy of having a separate system at the chart desk inside.

Appreciate your input on this.
Thank You.
 

HerbertFriedman

Member III
If i understand the technology, using an app on a laptop, tablet or even smart phone, a cellular connections is required either internally or using a stand alone hot spot device. A cellular connection is not required for a marine plotter device, so has no cellular connectivity off shore been a problem?
 

Baslin

Member III
If i understand the technology, using an app on a laptop, tablet or even smart phone, a cellular connections is required either internally or using a stand alone hot spot device. A cellular connection is not required for a marine plotter device, so has no cellular connectivity off shore been a problem?


You can get an ipad with an internal GPS....The ipads that allow a cellular connection are the ones that have the internal GPS but the cellular activation is not necessary
 

Loren Beach

O34 - Portland, OR
Senior Moderator
Blogs Author
If i understand the technology, using an app on a laptop, tablet or even smart phone, a cellular connections is required either internally or using a stand alone hot spot device. A cellular connection is not required for a marine plotter device, so has no cellular connectivity off shore been a problem?

My last two Mac laptops used a plug-in GPS 'hockey puck' for picking up the sat. signals.
The specs for the iPad with GPS say that it operates independently of a cell signal.
 

bgary

Advanced Beginner
Blogs Author
So I tried to do some keyboarding input on a demo new iPad this weekend at a vendor store, and... while the OS moves like magic lightning using the touch access, the flat keyboard was difficult to use. As in Really Difficult

What kind of keyboard?

I have traveled with iPad+keyboard (vs. laptop) on occasion, and although it took me several tries to find a keyboard I liked, I did, and it works.

For me, it comes down to the feel and the layout. I (personally) hate touch-type keyboards, I really like the tactile feel of a key that actually moves. And I'd much rather tote around a full-size keyboard that has the keys at the right size and spacing than fumble with a reduced/foldable/whatever keyboard that is easier to carry but harder to type on.

The actual BlueTooth connectivity is usually more than good enough to deliver good performance.

I haven't kept up on which keyboards are currently best-of-breed but Logitech is usually a good brand to start with. Some keyboards also include a touch-pad, which is nice (I find it annoying to have to take a hand off the keyboard to move the mouse or click a button)

Bruce

Edited to add: yes, I can confirm that GPS works on cell-enabled iPhones and iPads, even without presence of a cell signal. Apparently Apple built some of the GPS circuitry (antenna?) into the cell package, so if it isn't cell-enabled, the hardware to make GPS work isn't there.
 
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toddster

Curator of Broken Parts
Blogs Author
My iPad is so old that it may not be relevant to current offerings. Compared to the even older MacBook that I was using to run MacENC, it has pros and cons. Uses much less power! Runs day and night without draining the batteries or needing an inverter to charge. Waterproof cases are available, though I haven't found any with much longevity. It does run nav programs without issue, and links to ship's instruments via WiFi (but not while doing anything else.) It also runs a pretty slick Raymarine emulation program so it can double as a portable remote for the used a78 system I recently installed. But it does not, of course, connect to the AIS or Radar via USB, like the laptop did, which is occasionally necessary to change settings or debug. I never got the AIS overlay to work over WiFi on iNavX, but it does work fine with the Raymarine program. I have a logitech keyboard for it that is ok for punching out a short log entry. Or this post. But if I attempt to type at normal speed, it drops characters in every second word, and the auto-incorrect has lots of fun scrambling the result into something that looks like Lorum Ipsem. A new iPad would be tempting, if for no other reason than the ability to use the stylus to draw quick sketches. And slaving it to the (new) laptop for more screen real-estate. Maybe later this year, if business is good...

This... er Last year, I replaced an ancient iMac with a new MacBook Pro. But I've hardly used the keyboard. I've got it running two external monitors and an extended keyboard on my desk. Although it could go on the boat, it hasn't yet.

Another option: I picked up an old HP laptop on Ebay with a license sticker for Windoze 7. For about $100, it runs all the freeware/shareware navigation and ham radio programs that don't grok Mac. Including the configuration software for the radios. Or at least the versions that run on 7. But it's as much a power hog as the old MacBook.
 

HerbertFriedman

Member III
Loren and Baslin, so if I understand your comments, either I get a table with cellular (and then it has independent GPS) or I use my old tablet which just has WIFI and use an external GPS. I have an older Garmin handheld unit which has GPS and my Furuno radar/chart plotter has an external GPS so I just need to figure out how to hook up that signal to my tablet. My tablet is an old Ipad which may not have a GPS input so I may be stuck buying a newer tablet. Thanks for the clarification.
 

fool

Member III
2+5=7, 3+4=7, 6+1=7, lots of alternatives yielding similar results.

I liked GPSnavx on the macbook pro with the hockey puck GPS and still do. So much so that the puck and program got added to the Mac Mini when the "entertainment system" arrived on the scene.

Then read somewhere some of the folks at Latitude 38 had been cruising the Pacific Coast of the USA, Mexico, and beyond using an iPad exclusively and over multiple years. Ended up getting an iPad for another reason (get the LTE/cellular version for onboard GPS, no cellular activation required) and went to iNavX. If you have a non-cellular pad you can get an external GPS that plugs into the USB C. Bad Elf makes one such device and a brand that gets stellar (was there a pun in there somewhere?) reviews for about the cost of a Ben Franklin.

Thought it would be cool to overlay AIS and along came an iAIS receiver/modem by Digital Yachts. This unit uses the wireless TCP/UDP connection to accomplish this goal. Nifty stuff until the iPad goes to sleep and you have to wake it up to reload the AIS broadcast. In hindsight I think I'd prefer linking the AIS to the MFD through the VHF/AIS, although it is cool to have the information on the iNavX chart. (Not to mention most major MFD manufacturers have apps that will duplicate onto pads or tablets, Garmin & Raymarine as examples.)

Then came across a refurbished 12" ipad pro, now we're talkin' style... and iNavX along with it's multitude of ancillary add-ons and accessories, some for a fee: Tides, Theyr (not at typo) Weather, GRIB, Anchor Alarm, Charts, Waypoints, Routes, Tracking, Compass, COG, HDG, SOG, ALT, LAT, LON, UTC...etc...

The accessory ipad pro keyboard feels similar to and functions much like macbook pro except for the emoji key that is inconveniently located under the ball of my left thumb. Don't need a mouse as the pad has all the usual touch/pinch swipes for on-screen navigation (double entendre, not a pun).

For some silly reason I also ended up with a windows OS laptop/tablet convertible thingy. Something to do with computability with the IT department at work. Figured, why not? and busted out some cash for Rose Point - Coastal Explorer and a GPS hockey puck. A nifty program, just as intuitive as any of the iNav stuff, with the addition of Active Captain and Engine Instrumentation. A Highly recommended program if you're stuck in a windows world.

Having come full circle also reminds me that 1+6=7, 4+3=7, and 5+2=7. Pick a navigation system with a good reputation be it laptop/computer/tablet/phone/pad and know how to use it very well. You won't likely be too far off the mark.
 

Marlin Prowell

E34 - Bellingham, WA
Virginia and I are long time Mac, iPad, and iPhone owners. I am a life-long computer nerd and Mac developer.

Loren: both Virginia and I use have 12.9 iPad Pros, and we use them every day. I’m typing this on my iPad Pro right now. I’m using the on-screen keyboard and I can type quickly and the autocorrect is pretty amazing. In the previous sentence, I typed “im” and it was auto-corrected to “I’m”. I can type quickly and my mistakes are fixed.

Virginia has Apple's “Smart Keyboard”, but I would not recommend it on a boat. It makes the iPad top heavy; not good on a nav table. You could choose a Logitech wraparound keyboard, which looks more stable, or use an external Bluetooth keyboard. If you are going to buy an iPad, I’d suggest the 12.9 inch iPad Pro. The screen is as big as a 13" laptop. In my opinion, a bigger screen is always better. Regardless, you should get a wrap-around front and back cover.

I find the iPad keyboard very usable, but it takes some getting used to. Virginia finds that, when using her laptop instead of her iPad, she is constantly poking the laptop screen and wondering why it doesn’t respond to her touch. She is now more accustomed to the iPad with a keyboard than the laptop.

Our iPads are not cell enabled, so they do not have GPS capabilities. They have WiFi. We use our phones as WiFi hot spots for connecting our iPads to the cell network, but that’s getting into extra geeky territory.

Navigation: I have a Garmin MFD in the cockpit with WiFi. There is a Garmin app that lets me mirror the Garmin display on the iPad. My backup navigation is my iPhone (with GPS) with the Navionics app. I can hold the phone in my hand and check navigation progress independently.

AIS: my Icom radio receives AIS info and broadcasts it on the boat’s NMEA2000 network. The Garmin MFD displays the AIS info. Very useful. As an alternative to a cell-enabled iPad, you could get a Vesper XB-8000, recommended in the January issue of Practical Sailor “Networking the Old and New”. This gives you both an AIS transponder and a WiFi network on board. The XB-8000 transmits your GPS coordinates and other boat AIS locations over the WiFi network which your iPad will receive. You’ll need to check your iPad apps to see if they understand GPS and AIS info over WiFi. Vesper Marine lists a number of mobile apps that are compatible.

HerbertFriedman: I don’t know how to get the GPS data to the iPad from your external devices you mention.

I would not use an iPad as a navigation device in the cockpit. I know someone who installed an iPad mount on the binnacle and they found that the iPad would overheat and shut down when always on and in constant daylight on summer days.
 

kiwisailor

Member III
Blogs Author
I have multiple systems networked on my E38. The original JRC-1800 Radar/Chartplotter installed at the Navpod at the helm still works and is my backup chartplotter and is networked to my Raymarine NG (NMEA 2000) bus. In addition I have a Raymarine A78 chartplotter installed at the nav station, this unit is used for installing firmware updates to the Raymarine devices and when I want to monitor wind speed etc. below when at anchor or moored.

My primary chartplotter is a Samsung Galaxy Tab 10.1 tablet with OpenCPN that is wifi connected to my Vesper AIS unit which in turn is networked onto the Raymarine NG bus. Using the tablet I receive all AIS target data and depth/wind/speed etc. The tablet gets attached to the binnacle just above the Navpod when sailing.

My primary GPS source is from the Vesper AIS unit, my backup GPS source is from the JRC-1800 unit or the ICOM radio as it also has an internal GPS receiver and finally the tablet itself also has its own internal GPS antenna.

I will say OpenCPN is a great and very capable charting application.

Navigation Network 2020.jpg
 
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