Need Help Cutting Teak and Holly Panels

[JSM]

Getting ready to install a new sole in my 87 34-2. Have sealed the panels with CPES and am now at the stage where I can begin slicing the sheets up into (10) usable pieces. I made patterns of the existing floor boards out of 4mill plastic film from an art supply store and marked where all of the holly lines are on each piece. After reading all of the posts here (3 times , at least) I was under the impression that two sheets were enough for my boat.
Seems that no matter how I lay the patterns out on the sheets I'm coming up short of wood.
In my research it seems that no one seemed to have issues with cutting and lining the pieces up. Is it easier to just cut one piece at a time and use it as a guide for the next piece starting at the bow and working toward the stern ?
I think my fear of butchering this expensive material is causing me to way overthink the operation.
Any tips or tricks from those with past experience would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks
John

 

[Loren Beach]

There is a (long and helpful) past thread here where I recall that several owners got a perfect smooth cut using a router bit.
When I added an access piece to one of our sole sections where the factory had not installed one, I did use a fine-tooth high quality blade in my saber saw and it seemed to work fine with no splintering. Best to cut outside the line a tad and finish back with a sander, IMHO.
Or, did I try to answer a question that you did not actually ask?

 

[markvone]

Hi John,

I can't help with layout issues but I did cut my existing 3/4 teak and holly sole with my Makita circular saw and the standard blade to extend an existing cut done by the factory and you can't see any difference, clean no splintering. I also cut new 1/4 inch teak plywood for my cabin sides with my jigsaw and a fine 22 tooth blade. This cut very cleanly with no splintering at all.

Mark

 

[JSM]

Thanks guys. Finally figured it out (really my wife did). Spent too much time staring at it this afternoon and got a bit over analytical. Came back this evening with a fresh perspective (and my wife) and things fell into place fairly quickly.
Loren, within your non answer was a pearl of wisdom. Will definitely be staying outside the lines !
Thanks
John
https://photos.app.goo.gl/V5lBHeWExsvo4Hwn1

 

[kapnkd]

Getting ready to install a new sole in my 87 34-2. Have sealed the panels with CPES and am now at the stage where I can begin slicing the sheets up into (10) usable pieces. I made patterns of the existing floor boards out of 4mill plastic film from an art supply store and marked where all of the holly lines are on each piece. After reading all of the posts here (3 times , at least) I was under the impression that two sheets were enough for my boat.
Seems that no matter how I lay the patterns out on the sheets I'm coming up short of wood.
In my research it seems that no one seemed to have issues with cutting and lining the pieces up. Is it easier to just cut one piece at a time and use it as a guide for the next piece starting at the bow and working toward the stern ?
I think my fear of butchering this expensive material is causing me to way overthink the operation.
Any tips or tricks from those with past experience would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks
John

I'm WAY LATE with input for you personally considering you're well on your way with the REAL product. Sounds/reads like you've gotten great advise and are well on your way - especially in wisely seeking the wisdom of one's wife! ...We may be the "Captain" but indeed wives are most often the "Admiral"!!!

BUT, perhaps for others contemplating similar sole replacement or enhancement, may I suggest the chicken (easier) way we took a few years back.

Back in '73 Ericson delivered our boat - with ALL things - SHAG CARPETING throughout!!! :crying: THAT was THE THING back in the day, but it didn't last more than a few day sails in the marine world!! Especially living in Florida where every sail usually included an anchoring for a nice swim.

In self defense, I added a teak & holly sole to the galley area. It proved too difficult to maintain and after a few years had lots of who knows what ground into it in spite of vigilant efforts to maintain it.

Not too long ago (2012??) we went with the vinyl product "PlasDECK" out of Ohio which was sooooo much easier to work with on a sole with multiple contours!! (With the previous veneered wood product, I had concrete blocks sitting on the galley floor with 3M 5200 forever holding it down to get it to stick!)

Best part now, the PlasDECK is easy to clean, went in with ease using a fair amount of patience in cutting the vinyl to fit. (Paper patterns are a must.) I even worked in a West/East pattern between compartments to break the pattern up. Now, years later with our newer restoration projects, the flooring is messed up with fiberglass dust and more, but we're hopeful it WILL clean up OK. (I'll keep you all posted.)

At any rate, here's how it all turned out at the time. Note that I kept some carpeting (NOT SHAG) in the main salon. This was due to the elongated bilge access being a pain to negotiate around with either real teak & holly or a vinyl product. Besides, the carpeting adds a bit of warmth to the main salon - especially on one of those just read a book non-sailing days.

 

[JSM]

So far, so good. Have about half of the panels cut out and will get the rest cut in the next few days. Have been using a circular saw with a plywood/finishing blade and a Bosch jig saw for the rrest . Prior to cutting I applied two coats of Smiths CPES to both sides of the wood and used Frog Tape on all cutting lines. This has resulted in absolutely no chip out. Probably the most time consuming part so far has been making the templates and transferring them to the wood.
Early on in the planning stages I looked into using Plastique etc. for the floor and them realized that I would have to install new sub-flooring first and them the man made material on top of that. Seemed to me like double the labor and more expense and besides I like the look of real wood.
The last sole made it thirty years. this one will probably outlive me.

 

[kapnkd]

So far, so good. Have about half of the panels cut out and will get the rest cut in the next few days. Have been using a circular saw with a plywood/finishing blade and a Bosch jig saw for the rrest . Prior to cutting I applied two coats of Smiths CPES to both sides of the wood and used Frog Tape on all cutting lines. This has resulted in absolutely no chip out. Probably the most time consuming part so far has been making the templates and transferring them to the wood.
Early on in the planning stages I looked into using Plastique etc. for the floor and them realized that I would have to install new sub-flooring first and them the man made material on top of that. Seemed to me like double the labor and more expense and besides I like the look of real wood.
The last sole made it thirty years. this one will probably outlive me.

I've copied/pasted your clean cutting process onto a Word document for future reference. GREAT advice! My son has a Bosch jig saw and there IS a difference in the performance. We used cardboard to make our bulkhead templates. They were easier to use to insure a good fit prior to tracing and cutting the panels. (We went to Home Depot and asked if they had any large pieces of cardboard from refrigerator shipments.) Also, it answered the question of IF the panels would go down the companion way.

I'm not that familiar with the cabin soles of the E-3 series of Ericson boats. Sounds like they have relatively flat floors, or at least much more so, than the older E-2 boats. You're totally correct in that nothing beats the look and warmth of real wood. It's one of those decisions each of us need to make as what works best and overall for the project.

Looking forward to hopefully seeing some photos of your projects as you progress.
-kerry

 

[JSM]

Thanks kapnkd, most of what I've done so far has been gleaned from my predecessors here on the board. One step that I added, and it may be a bit of overkill was to transfer my acetate patterns to 1/4" foam insulation board that I found at Home Depot. The board comes in a 50' long "fan fold". I then took the foam patterns back to the boat and double checked their shape with the corresponding floor panels.
The folding foam board is nice in the fact that the patterns can be folded for easy transport and storage. I will be keeping them to use as a protective covering for the new sole during future projects.

 

[kapnkd]

Thanks kapnkd, most of what I've done so far has been gleaned from my predecessors here on the board. One step that I added, and it may be a bit of overkill was to transfer my acetate patterns to 1/4" foam insulation board that I found at Home Depot. The board comes in a 50' long "fan fold". I then took the foam patterns back to the boat and double checked their shape with the corresponding floor panels.
The folding foam board is nice in the fact that the patterns can be folded for easy transport and storage. I will be keeping them to use as a protective covering for the new sole during future projects.

WOW! Really looking good! Nice job! You're more than smart to keep the foam boards for future project floor protection. We used simple roll paper from Home Depot but it soon became torn and the Plas Deck got dirtied to our dismay. Ah well, ...just another clean up task for us to be added to the "Never Ending Project".

 

[Mark F]

Looking good John!

Kerry's point about a flat sole is something to consider for people thinking about adding a wood floor to an older E boat that didn't come from the factory with floor panels. The E27 cabin sole has areas that are quite curved. My approach was to use individual tongue & groove boards of 3/8" thick mahogany and maple. The boards are thin enough that they can be bent and glued to the floor contour by applying pressure with "sticks" wedged between the cabin-top ceiling and the sole boards. An added advantage to this method is that for most of the cuts you are only making 3" joint cuts. If you make a mistake it's just a 2 1/2" wide piece of wood that you can likely use somewhere else.