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New Stainless Steel Handrails

Tom Guild

E34 - Annapolis
Just finished installing new handrails as the final project of a fairly extensive refit on my 89' Ericson 34 over the past year. Went with 316 SS oval/eliptical tubing that matched the same shape of the teak rails very well. We had to curve them a little to match the contours of the boat and they remained flawless throughout the process. A traditionalist by nature, had to think long and hard about changing out the teak, but very happy with the end result.
 

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Loren Beach

O34 - Portland, OR
Senior Moderator
Blogs Author
Nice! There are pix on this site, back about 10 years or so, of an E-38 with that same mod. That boat was in Florida waters.
Did you weld a little 'plug' on each end and then buff it out?
 

Tom Guild

E34 - Annapolis
Very nice. Was bending just by hand, in the field? And the drilled holes in the stainless--marked and drilled by eye?
Hi Christian. We used a table in the M-Yachts shop to do the bending. The old teak handrails maintained the arc/bend well, having been in the same position for over thirty years. They made a good template for both the bend and marking the holes - with many trips to the boat to double check.
 

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Tom Guild

E34 - Annapolis
Nice! There are pix on this site, back about 10 years or so, of an E-38 with that same mod. That boat was in Florida waters.
Did you weld a little 'plug' on each end and then buff it out?
Thanks Loren. Yes - I ended up getting the rails from a UK company called Timeless Tube out of Poole, England www.timelesstube.com The rails came with the end pieces/caps in place but we had to remove and replace one end on each when we cut for the correct size.
 

jtsai

Member III
That look spiffy! Question, how are the rails attached to the cabin, long self-tapping screw or thru-bolted?
 
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Tom Guild

E34 - Annapolis
That look spiffy! Question, how are the rails attached to the cabin, long self-tapping screw or thru-bolted?
Hi Jeff, We used long self-tapping screw and used 3M-4000. The orignal rails were screwed in the same way and held firm for over 30 years, so we deceided to do the same without backing. The handrails on the 89' E34 fit into a slot that is slightly raised.
 

Jerry VB

E32-3 / M-25XP
Nicely done. I'm looking at doing the handrail replacement on my E32-3 - one side was "delicate" and ended up getting broken during launch. As a result, the priority on replacing them went from "someday" to "now."

Questions:
  • What tubing did you use? 39.5mm x 20.5mm (best match for 1.5" x 0.75")?
  • How did you procure it? Did Timeless Tube work with you to ship it from England?
According to Timeless Tube's web page, they sell smaller lengths via eBay, but their listing is the UK eBay, they don't list the 39.5mm x 20.5mm size, and they have a note about not shipping to the US.
 

Tom Guild

E34 - Annapolis
Nicely done. I'm looking at doing the handrail replacement on my E32-3 - one side was "delicate" and ended up getting broken during launch. As a result, the priority on replacing them went from "someday" to "now."

Questions:
  • What tubing did you use? 39.5mm x 20.5mm (best match for 1.5" x 0.75")?
  • How did you procure it? Did Timeless Tube work with you to ship it from England?
According to Timeless Tube's web page, they sell smaller lengths via eBay, but their listing is the UK eBay, they don't list the 39.5mm x 20.5mm size, and they have a note about not shipping to the US.
Thanks Jerry. I worked with Geoff Day over at Timeless Tube out of Poole, England www.timelesstube.com - he was great - and shipped with Alpha Global Logistics www.alphagloballogistics.co.uk. Timeless prepared and packed the tubes very well and Alpha Global Logistics picked them up and did a fantastic job shipping. Timeless can send lengths up to 1 meter directly, but will work with any carrier to send longer lengths. I ordered two 3 meter lengths of oval SS 316, polished to a mirror finish with the following dimensions: W-37mm (1.46”); H-21mm (.83”); and thickness is 2mm (.08”). They fit very nicely with a little bending to match the contours of the boat. I used the old handrails as a template for the curve and screw holes. You may want to call Geoff directly. He seems to be able to get just about any size of tubing. I had looked everywhere in the states and found that I would either have to order at least a ton of tubing from most suppliers or pay a huge premium from the few that would discuss selling two 10' sections. Even with the shipping, the price of the tubes were less than half of the quotes I received in the states. Also, Taco had some tubing in their old catalog that looked nice and at a reasonable price, but I was advised that it had been discontinued. After my tubes arrived from England, one of the suppliers I had worked with called and said that Taco may be producing them again, so they may be worth a check as well.
 

Jerry VB

E32-3 / M-25XP
Two tubes are on order: Stainless Steel 316L, Oval Tube, 37 x 21 x 2mm, Bright Finish, delivered as 2 x 2.85m lengths plus four end caps. Lead time is ~2 weeks for fabrication and another ~2 weeks for shipping. I opted out of the mirror finish polishing because that was another ~2 weeks (and £100). Payment was via Paypal, so that was pretty simple.

The handrails are for an E32-3 - I measured the existing ones at 8'3" (2.52m) so I initially requested 3m tubes (Timeless quotes 0.5m increments). Goeff asked if the 3m length was critical - he was able to reduce the shipping charges by dropping the length to 2.85m so that worked for me.

Now I need to put together a bending jig...
 

Christian Williams

E381 - Los Angeles
Senior Moderator
Blogs Author
I was talking to Dave at Railmakers (Costa Mesa, CA) about something else, and asked him about elliptical tubing.

He has some, but not all sizes, the supply chain is all mucked up these days, and so on--but put him on the call list for handrail projects.

Railmakers is very good with Ericson stuff, and often has patterns.
 

bumbugo

Member I
Two tubes are on order: Stainless Steel 316L, Oval Tube, 37 x 21 x 2mm, Bright Finish, delivered as 2 x 2.85m lengths plus four end caps. Lead time is ~2 weeks for fabrication and another ~2 weeks for shipping. I opted out of the mirror finish polishing because that was another ~2 weeks (and £100). Payment was via Paypal, so that was pretty simple.

The handrails are for an E32-3 - I measured the existing ones at 8'3" (2.52m) so I initially requested 3m tubes (Timeless quotes 0.5m increments). Goeff asked if the 3m length was critical - he was able to reduce the shipping charges by dropping the length to 2.85m so that worked for me.

Now I need to put together a bending jig...
Please post your progress with the new handrails. This is a great option especially for those of us in southern climates. Thanks.
 

Jerry VB

E32-3 / M-25XP
Please post your progress with the new handrails. This is a great option especially for those of us in southern climates. Thanks.
Will do. The current status is:
  • I finalized my order by calling Geoff Day, however he has since left Timeless. My interaction with Timeless, other than one phone call, has been via their (generic) email address "Info Timeless Tube" <Info@timelesstube.com>
  • I ordered the tube ends uninstalled since I need to cut one end of the tube to length.
  • My tubes are scheduled to be manufactured June 14 and then ~2 weeks for shipping so they should be showing up early July.
On my E32-3, the bend in the handrail is about 1.5" over 8'3" so there is not much bend. The long axis of the tube is mounted about 45 degrees (by eyeball) to the cabin top so the bend is a little trickier since it has to be ~45 degrees off the tube axis.
 

Jerry VB

E32-3 / M-25XP
Following @Tom Guild's lead, I ordered two oval tubes from Timeless Tubes. I ordered them to the same specs as Tom: Stainless Steel 316L, Oval Tube, 37 x 21 x 2mm thick walls. Since I was not confident in the length, I ordered them over-long (2.85m) and cut them to size. Since I planned to cut them to size, I had Timeless send me unattached endcaps. It Turns Out I could have ordered the tubes to size (2.49m) with the endcaps welded on but my risk tolerance (self confidence) was too low.

I worked with Geoff Day to generate the initial quote, but he resigned from Timeless after I placed the order (strictly coincidental). Tom McMillian inherited the order and all went well. The fabrication and shipping beat their estimated lead times; the quote was for two to three weeks for fabrication and one to two weeks for shipment. I ordered them May 27, they were shipped June 13, and I received them June 18.

The cross section of the tubes is a near perfect match to the wood handrails:
1660150134065.png

In preparation, I removed the wood handrails (one intact, one in pieces), cleaned off the adhesive/sealant (Anti-Bond for the win!), and filled the existing screw holes with thickened epoxy (I cheated and used MarineTex).

The cabintop mounting is 2.5" for the fore attachment point, then 14" gap followed by a 5" landing, repeated until the aft end which was about 5". I figured 19" on center but my mounting screws came out slightly shifted by the end so the "landings" are slightly less than 19" on center but not enough to cause a problem.

I had some 10' 2x10 lumber in my "scrap" pile so I used one as a mockup cabintop and one to make a bending jig. I cut a length of 2x6 on a 45 degree angle and then cut it into 5" sections to match the cabintop handrail "landings". I screwed the "landing" sections to my 2x10 lumber with offsets of 0" (fore), 0.5", 1.0", 1.25", 0.75", and 0" (aft). I was able to make the unbent tubing conform to the cabintop bend, but I was uncomfortable with the force necessary. Holding the rail in position while drilling screw holes etc. would have been very challenging without prebending the rail.

Cabintop simulation jig:
1660150782468.png

I made a bending jig out of my second 2x10 by using the "landing" offcut (45 degrees) cut into short sections and then screwed in an arc on the bending jig 2x10. I arbitrarily made the arc to be 4' long with 1.5" offset in the center. This worked OK but a little more radius would have been helpful (maybe 2" offset in the center). Note that the bending jig bends with the bottom side of the rail "up" so that the 45 degree angle traps the tube rather than having to fight it from "popping out" of the jig.

I first bent the port rail mostly with the jig as pictured, then I moved the "stopper" block to the other side of the curve and finished bending the other end of the tube. That way the tube itself gives you plenty of leverage to bend the portion that needs to be bent.

Once I had the port rail bent, I unscrewed the blocks and refastened them "mirror image" to do the starboard rail.

Bending jig:
1660150824293.png

Bending the rail:
1660150972323.png

The cabintop jig with the starboard rail "installed" and the port rail next to it. The blue tape is where the "lands" on the cabintop are. As you can see, there isn't a lot of bend, but it made installation go smoothly with only a little force needed to make the rails conform to the real cabintop.
1660151317677.png

I temporarily used #12 pan head screws to attach the rails because they were available at the local WM store. I bought a box of #14 1.5" long Stainless Steel Oval Head Screws for Sheet Metal from McMaster-Carr for the final installation.

Results...

Fore attachment point:
1660151575117.png

Aft-most full landing showing the slight offset of the screws:
1660151633319.png

Aft attachment point:
1660151673860.png

The white spots are the old screw holes that I filled using MarineTex. Those screw holes are the only ones visible with the rails installed.

ToDo:
  • Remove the handrails at the end of the season and have end caps welded on.
  • When I reinstall the rails, I'll countersink the top screw holes in the rails and use the pretty oval head screws.
 

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Jerry VB

E32-3 / M-25XP
Addendum: I predrilled the holes in the handrail (drill press at home) so I would not have to drill holes in the stainless steel using a hand drill while holding the rail in place.

To install the handrails for the first time, I started at the fore end, drilled a pilot hole into the cabintop, and installed the first screw. I then moved to successive "landings" - while my wife held the rail in place I drilled the pilot holes and installed the screws. I installed the aft end screws before the last "landing" so my wife would have some leverage to hold the end in place. I'm not sure that was necessary, but it was successful.
 
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