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Repair Hull Deck Joint under rub rail

Tin Kicker

Sustaining Member
Moderator
The previous owner of my 32-3 had inadequately tied her when a major storm came through and pounding against pylon split the mid-portions of the hull-deck seam under the rub-rails. Quite ugly but I have some background in working with fiberglass so it's why I got her for a low price.
20190112_121051-X4.jpg


This needs to be fixed from the outside because the seam between deck and hull has a couple of plies of glass on the interior. You can not get to the joint from the interior. Be aware that those added coarse layers were sloppy from the factory and are NOT water-tight. There's a pretty good gap in spots between them and the seams. Below is what the joint looks like in cross section and the photo on the right shows why these boats are so stout. Even where rubbing a pylon had worn the flanged of the joint nearly to the contour of the hull, there's still a good half-inch of material with the interior plies spanning across the joint to hold the deck to the hull.

Hull%20Deck%20joint-X2.jpg


To repair:
1. Remove the old rub rail, then the silicone sealer beneath it. Notice how the silicone was not completely sealed to the boat, allowing the seam to probably leak even where there was no damage.
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2. Lightly sand the crud to the surface of the paint because sanding is about the only way to really get anything new to stick where silicone had been. For sanding both the surface and in the radius, a finger belt worked best:
713sUAEAoZL._AC_SL1500_.jpg

https://www.amazon.com/WEN-6307-Variable-Detailing-Sander/dp/B072Q2FTLY/ref=asc_df_B072Q2FTLY/?tag=hyprod-20&linkCode=df0&hvadid=309802506143&hvpos=&hvnetw=g&hvrand=5348097485406991147&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=c&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9007798&hvtargid=pla-588003624477&psc=1

I use plenty of mineral spirits to wipe down the area regularly.

3. Dig out the loose stuff then grind to clean glass.
20200312_180048-X4.jpg


The tool on the Multimax is sold at Lowes and Home Depot for removal of tile grout. Imagine being a dentist and getting an old loose filling out of a tooth.
20200312_184420-X4.jpg


Clean it out with a vacuum & more mineral spirit wipes.

4. Stick blue tape only along the bottom of the seam with the top half not pressed in place. Use the wide tape, not the 3/4" like I used because I had to lay three rows horizontally. (See photo below) The top half of the tape laying out gives something to guide the new epoxy and hold it in the seam when the top of the tape gets pressed in place. Go slow and work in as much epoxy as possible, using a piece of wire or something to help the epoxy really fill the joint.

After the epoxy is in for several feet adhere the top half of the tape and add vertical strips because this isn't precise brain surgery and the epoxy may be where the tape is trying to adhere. I used the TotalBoat flexible epoxy and it set fast enough that the tape wetting or losing adhesion was not a problem. The epoxy sets fast enough that this whole operation is done with lots of fresh little Dixie cups and it helps to have an assistant mixing the next couple of ounces as you work epoxy into the joint.

This is what it looked like the next day when the tape was pulled off. The missing paint above the seam is from the finger sander cleaning out the dirt and silicone.
20200324_173124-X4.jpg

btw - Notice how clean the tape looks where it'd been stuck to the boat. That's because the sanding and mineral spirits had been used to clean everything repeatedly.

5. There were some gaps to add thickened epoxy into like below, but very few. This is where the epoxy had drained through the back side of the joint.
20200324_174006-X4.jpg


5. Sand smooth, fill the surface imperfections like the sanded areas seen above, prime, paint, and add new rub rail.
 
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I just found your post which is a big help in analyzing a possible purchase of a 1987 Ericson 38 in Salem, MA.

I would guess that this is a 40+ hour project for both sides of the hull, one that needs to be done on dry land in warm weather so that the epoxy stays viscous?

Where did you source the new rub rails?

Larry Clough
Bella Luna - 1986 Ericson 32
Cape Elizabeth, ME
 

Tin Kicker

Sustaining Member
Moderator
Between a new business taking off and family my progress on the boat essentially stopped before getting the rails on. I am probably making my own.
 

Christian Williams

E381 - Los Angeles
Senior Moderator
Blogs Author
Great report from Bob. Really explains how the hull/deck joint can admit water even without having structural integrity issues.

As for the rub rails on this model, they are specific and the originals are no longer available. The rub rail is only cosmetic, and serves to cover over the 3/8ths flange left by the manufacturing process.

I used a Taco product on both the E32-3 and E381. Expensive, but looks original, or better.

 

Tin Kicker

Sustaining Member
Moderator
Thanks Christian -

While the Taco rails are (or are like?) the original, I've seen a really nice job done with light grey TREX and the owner said he was still pleased with it after a couple of years. He ripped long TREX boards on the table saw, routed a nice round edge on the cut edge, which became the bottom of the rub rail, and routed a groove on the back side for the hull/deck seam. There was maybe a half-inch between them filled with gray silicone, so he could replace any that got damaged and it also gave a bit of thermal expansion to the ends of each section.

I thought it was pretty clever, looked good, and would stand up to a lot more than the OEM aluminum, plus inexpensive. After all, the E32 would just need two 16 ft boards, since cutting doubles their length.
 

Christian Williams

E381 - Los Angeles
Senior Moderator
Blogs Author
Yep, that would work. Need some routing and roundover skills. Sand off the texture. I've made a lot of stuff out of Trex, and it's impervious and takes a beating, but of course it still looks like Trex.
 
One further issue is that the Taco web site suggests that it will no longer be making the A11-0511 rub rail since it labels that product "CLEARANCE – ALL SALES FINAL."

Larry Clough
1986 E-32
Cape ELizabeth, Maine
 

tenders

Innocent Bystander
Thanks Christian -

While the Taco rails are (or are like?) the original, I've seen a really nice job done with light grey TREX and the owner said he was still pleased with it after a couple of years. He ripped long TREX boards on the table saw, routed a nice round edge on the cut edge, which became the bottom of the rub rail, and routed a groove on the back side for the hull/deck seam. There was maybe a half-inch between them filled with gray silicone, so he could replace any that got damaged and it also gave a bit of thermal expansion to the ends of each section.

I thought it was pretty clever, looked good, and would stand up to a lot more than the OEM aluminum, plus inexpensive. After all, the E32 would just need two 16 ft boards, since cutting doubles their length.
Any insight on how the Trex was attached to the hull? And did he find boards that were thicker than the 0.88” shown on the Trex website? (Seems like that isn’t thick enough to create much of a lip around the hull-to-deck joint.) I’ll be painting my hull this spring and am not looking forward to dealing with the aluminum rubrail, which doesn’t look great, doesn’t hold paint very well, and being aluminum is going to be a huge hassle to prep.
 

Christian Williams

E381 - Los Angeles
Senior Moderator
Blogs Author
Hmmm. All my 20-year-old Trex scraps from the deck are 1 1/8" thick. It looks like the current dimension for deck planks is 0.94.

 

tenders

Innocent Bystander
Interesting. The notched-side version thickness is 0.94, the square-side version thickness is 0.82 (I misremembered 0.88 from my $5 sample order this morning). Your 1.125” sure sounds better!

 

Tin Kicker

Sustaining Member
Moderator
Any insight on how the Trex was attached to the hull? And did he find boards that were thicker than the 0.88” shown on the Trex website? (Seems like that isn’t thick enough to create much of a lip around the hull-to-deck joint.) I’ll be painting my hull this spring and am not looking forward to dealing with the aluminum rubrail, which doesn’t look great, doesn’t hold paint very well, and being aluminum is going to be a huge hassle to prep.

He'd just used some dressy white screws.
No idea about the thickness.
 

tenders

Innocent Bystander
Aha. There is a “2x6” version of Trex lumber that matches Christian’s description. It’s just hard to find on the Trex website and may not be sold through the big box stores.
 

tenders

Innocent Bystander
Now that I got my Trex sample in the mail, I'm wondering whether Trex is really the product for this purpose. Trex is a "capped composite," meaning it's an unattractive brownish blend of wood and plastic particles dipped in a colored shell. The color isn't particularly thick and I can easily imagine it getting abraded off and looking terrible. It's also quite heavy.

Azek, and Veranda, on the other hand, are uniformly-colored PVC all the way through, noticeably lighter, and said to be more water-resistant. I'm going to investigate the available board thickness - looks like 1".
 

Stuphoto

Member III
My 25 mk1 has similar damage, from when it landed on a breakwater.
Same thing, I got her for cheap because of it.

I started the FG repair a couple weeks ago, but didn't know what to do about the rub rail.

I am curious how yours will turn out, and may copy it.

I am also wondering if you are planning on somehow reusing the existing holes, or plug them up and make new screw holes.
 
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Tin Kicker

Sustaining Member
Moderator
My 25 mk1 has similar damage, from when it landed on a breakwater.
Same thing, I got her for cheap because of it.

I started the FG repair a couple weeks ago, but didn't know what to do about the rub rail.

I am curious how yours will turn out, and may copy it.

I am also wondering if you are planning on somehow reusing the existing holes, or plug them up and make new screw holes.
Definitely plugged them with thickened epoxy Because you’d never hit the same holes twice.
 
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