Replacing clam cleat - what's involved?

[N.A.]

Hello folks-

The cam cleats (with eyestrap) that secure my traveler lines are dead... they no longer spring closed (though you can force them closed with your fingers and they will hold.) They are definitely old/dead; it's not just a bad spring (and same issue on both port and starboard cleats).

I am unsure what's involved in fixing/replacing them, and my boat maintenance books don't say. Is this as simple as "buy one, unscrew, and drop the new one on"? Or to avoid water damage to the deck do I need sealant, epoxy to deal with holes, and whatever else?

I have never replaced any deck hardware, as is probably obvious -- this seems like a low-stakes place to start. Any advice appreciated; I searched but did not see anything on replacing these things.

Best-

Neil

 

[N.A.]

Apologies; found information I missed on my first pass (helps to figure out the right keywords). Apparently cannot delete the post, so am listing the following in case anyone else ever has the same question. Thread can be closed.
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Take-home: it's a lot of work, or more precisely, a lot of tools and bits if you don't already have them. Definitely not screw-off, screw new one on.

Resources:
- Very helpful video from Nautica:

- Helpful page from Captain Ocean: https://captain-ocean.com/en/how-to-change-a-cam-cleat-on-a-boat/
Cleats on my boat seem to be 1.5" spacing Schaeffer Medium Entry Cam Cleats; Harken "150" cam cleats have the same screw spacing, look like a more robust and durable option, and have a larger selection of fairleads/eyestraps/rebuild kits/etc., like the Harken 459 kit based on the 150 cam.

 

[Loren Beach]

That's a better description of the process than many others that are lurking on the 'net. The shop where we recently did our re-fit uses a different system for the overfill-redrill process, but the result is very similar. Our chosen system results in potentially more disturbance of the surrounding deck surface -- something that is irrelevant when we intended to grind down the whole cabin and deck for repainting.

O34 - Deck & handrails, Casting Procedure(page 2) | Casting Hardware Fastener Holes

The shop is about to start on the final deck prep for painting. Quite a bit of work has gone into several other projects that were also planned for this re-fit. Not much to see yet, but considerable glass work has gone into prep for a furnace...

ericsonyachts.org

One caveat about the tape underneath - use a mylar shiny tape rather than a paper based tape because the epoxy can sometimes soak thru the paper backing.

Also, he shows countersinking the hole to allow a much improved 'gasket' of sealant to form. Good "belt and suspenders" approach.
High end builders would do this, too. Like Ericson in the 80's. Most of our deck penetrations had this countersink done by the factory. They did not also resin-fill and over-drill, but their system of huge backing "fender washers" with copious 5200 kept 99% of the moisture out until 30 years passed. EY did an above average job of sealing fasteners.

Of course, at this point in time ALL of their boats are in need of re-sealing ALL deck fastenings.
(I would hazard a guess that by epoxying all of the holes in our deck, we may have sealed them until the hardware itself has to be replaced in another 30 or 40 years. Something for future owners to worry about....)

Thanks again for the video post.
BTW, I am inclined to keep the original post, as it's a great lead-in to a multi-step project that has puzzled all of us at some point. If you look at the picture in my blog discussing this, my method is discussed, but I have nothing to match the excellent illustrations in the video.
Loren

 

[bigd14]

More good info here. Unfortunately Maine Sail does not currently have his store open to purchase the butyl tape as he is recovering from a stroke. It's hard to find good butyl tape.

Sealing Deck Penetrations To Prevent Core Rot - Marine How To

The Epoxy Supplies Most all boats have some sort of "core" in the decks. Whether it's balsa, plywood or some of the foam cores all can eventually absorb water from a leaking deck penetration. A leaking deck, especially with wood cores,

marinehowto.com

Bedding Deck Hardware With Bed-IT Tape - Marine How To

Originally published December 2003 *Moved & Edited September 2017 Bedding With Bed-It Tape 5/20/2022 IMPORTANT UPDATE BED-IT TAPE IS BACK PURCHASE BED-IT TAPE Countersunk/Beveled Hole Over the years,

marinehowto.com

 

[N.A.]

Many thanks for both the tape comment (Loren) and the MarineHowTo links (bigd14)-- that site is fantastic; unsure how I failed to check it.

--> The instructions there are extremely pertinent if one thought the video was the last word, and conveniently list every part one needs (the video does not tell you, e.g., exactly which filler to get, or which sealant).

FYI, the butyl tape still seems to be available from some suppliers (see below), and I think revenue still goes to Compass Marine (Maine Sail), based on the comments on the marinehowto link above.

PS: I am unsure about policy for this site, but suspect it is OK to also say the following (Sean: if not, and the policy is no links for donations to other sites, I totally understand and please just delete this paragraph): I am going to donate to Maine Sail anyway; my policy is to do so whenever I make significant use of his site, even if I cannot purchase from it due to the stroke and but the item elsewhere. I would encourage others to do the same -- little is more devastating than a hemorrhagic stroke, except having one while self employed. Plus, that site is such a testament to the power of a good engineering mindset -- I definitely know what I'm talking about there, and I still learn about my own trade every time I read those articles. What an incredible resource. His donate link is at the homepage, https://marinehowto.com/ . Needless to say (hopefully), we should all be donating to this site as well.

Compass Marine butyl tape from other suppliers:

Compass Marine Bed It Butyl Tape — Original Marine Supplies

High quality marine grade butyl tape!! Bed-It Tape is gray in color, 1/16" thick and 1/2" wide and comes in a 50' roll. Designed to survive the long term in the marine environment, it is the perfect consistency & width for bedding deck hardware. rolls are sold individually.

originalmarinesupplies.com

https://www.marineoutfitters.ca/index.cfm?category=10427|11795&product=54069231&code=BIBT (I used these folks; will post if it doesn't work out)

 

[Loren Beach]

A first hand reference is always welcome. I have donated (modestly) to his site regularly. It's one of the best information/tutorials on the 'net.
Thanks,
Loren

 

[Christian Williams]

Maine Sail ( R.C. Collins) needs it. Completely incapacitated as far as work goes.

The Ericson Organization, unlike sites supported by advertising (Sailnet), has no issue with sailing-related links or references to other sources of information.

 

[Bolo]

Apologies; found information I missed on my first pass (helps to figure out the right keywords). Apparently cannot delete the post, so am listing the following in case anyone else ever has the same question. Thread can be closed.
----------

Take-home: it's a lot of work, or more precisely, a lot of tools and bits if you don't already have them. Definitely not screw-off, screw new one on.

Resources:
- Very helpful video from Nautica:

- Helpful page from Captain Ocean: https://captain-ocean.com/en/how-to-change-a-cam-cleat-on-a-boat/
Cleats on my boat seem to be 1.5" spacing Schaeffer Medium Entry Cam Cleats; Harken "150" cam cleats have the same screw spacing, look like a more robust and durable option, and have a larger selection of fairleads/eyestraps/rebuild kits/etc., like the Harken 459 kit based on the 150 cam.

Apologies; found information I missed on my first pass (helps to figure out the right keywords). Apparently cannot delete the post, so am listing the following in case anyone else ever has the same question. Thread can be closed.
----------

Take-home: it's a lot of work, or more precisely, a lot of tools and bits if you don't already have them. Definitely not screw-off, screw new one on.

Resources:
- Very helpful video from Nautica:

- Helpful page from Captain Ocean: https://captain-ocean.com/en/how-to-change-a-cam-cleat-on-a-boat/
Cleats on my boat seem to be 1.5" spacing Schaeffer Medium Entry Cam Cleats; Harken "150" cam cleats have the same screw spacing, look like a more robust and durable option, and have a larger selection of fairleads/eyestraps/rebuild kits/etc., like the Harken 459 kit based on the 150 cam.

Great video on mounting hardware but when I’ve done it I never do the two step process (fill the over sized hole with epoxy, drain and then fill with epoxy/filler mix). I just fill the hole with pure epoxy to the top and then let it cure. IMO, this makes a much harder core to prevent deck crushing if the fitting is tightened done too hard. In short, I think that the epoxy/filler step unnecessary. I also use butyl tape rather then sealant.