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Two foot pumps, one problem

bsangs

E35-3 - New Jersey
Galley sink on our 35-3 has two foot pumps. Facing the sink, the one on the right is used to drain the two ice boxes, or to pump sea/lake/river water into the sink. Switching between the ice boxes and water is easy enough using a seacock, and a T with a couple valves (one for forward ice box, one for aft). My problem is the second foot pump, on the left. It pumps...nothing. I assumed it was for the fresh water tank(s). Ericson 35-3 manual makes it seem like it is for the fresh water tanks. Certainly sounds like it wants to pump water through it, as I hear what sounds like gurgling, but nothing ever comes through, not matter how long I pump. Have learned and accomplished a lot in the short time with the boat, but plumbing is not my forte. There are three fresh water tanks onboard - bow, port and starboard. If this foot pump is in working order, I assume it's only connected to one of the tanks. Have tried to follow the pipe that leads into it, but I get lost in a maze of tubing and wires that I'm not willing to start pulling apart at the risk of breaking other things that are working. Is that what needs to be done though? And if not, any suggestions to figure out this puzzle? Thanks in advance.
 

Christian Williams

E381 - Los Angeles
Senior Moderator
Blogs Author
It's probably a gusher mk3 by Whale. They get airlocked. Especially when not used much, the seals dry out.

I would remove it, test it, and not be surprised to have to buy the rebuild kit.

But first try priming it any way you can figure out.

gusher mk3 manual.jpg
 

Christian Williams

E381 - Los Angeles
Senior Moderator
Blogs Author
I guess I would first pump it with the electric pump on so water is flowing through the system. When I run my tanks dry, the chief issue in priming is those foot pumps.

What has worked is putting a finger over the vent (spout) for a moment, pumping both foot pumps, etc.

The issue seems to be that the foot pump is an offshoot of the main supply, and if it leaks air can un-prime the whole system.

Also, change whatever valves you have, perhaps selectors for icebox drain, salt water, fresh water.

As I recall the gushers are awkward to remove, just because of the installation. But then you can dunk the whole thing in a bucket and see if it pumps.

I guess the water line might also be cracked or disconnected, and you could try pulling the feed line off and priming the pump in place with a turkey baster, or a funnel or whatever else might work. I have no pride in such troubleshooting, or elegance, and whatever mess I make is never as bad as sucking siphon gas out of a tank and trying to stop before you get a mouthful.

I replaced a gusher because the arm had broken off, I don't think they're very expensive.
 

jtsai

Member III
Swap the non-working fresh water foot pump with the working sea water/frig drain foot pump. If it works, then you know. They are due for rebuild, especially the fresh water one. The rebuild kit is inexpensive and easy to perform.
 

bgary

Advanced Beginner
Blogs Author
I assume it's only connected to one of the tanks

I don't know about the 35-3, but on the 32-3 the fresh-water pump is connected through a manifold to all three tanks. If I open the locker under the sink and look up and aft and to starboard, I have a number of valves. Depending on which valve is open, the foot-pump pulls water from that tank and pumps it to the sink. If *none* of the valves are open... the footpump does nothing.

That's for the freshwater side (the right-hand one when I'm facing the sink)

For the saltwater side, there are a couple of different valves in play. One that leads from the icebox to the pump, one that leads from the seawater through-hull to the pump. The behaviors (on my boat) are
-- when the icebox valve is open and the valve going to the thru-hull is closed, the foot-pump pumps water out of the icebox (into the sink)
-- when the icebox valve is closed and the valve going to the thru-hull is open, the foot-pump pumps seawater into the sink
-- when both valves are open, it allows seawater to flow into the icebox <O_O>

Hope that helps.

Bruce
 

bgary

Advanced Beginner
Blogs Author
Swap the non-working fresh water foot pump with the working sea water/frig drain foot pump.

Hmmm. Whale makes two versions of the pump, a "right-hand" version and a "left-hand" version. They aren't interchangeable, at least not if re-mounting into the structure that Ericson built under the sink.
 

nquigley

Sustaining Member
One of mine leaked horribly. Last year, I bought the rebuild kit, but during disassembly and installation of the kit, I cracked a couple of the screw-mounting lugs, so I ordered two new ones - surprisingly inexpensive.
As I recall, the left- or right-handedness was easy to work out when comparing my units with pics on line when I was ordering new ones.
Mine were quite awkward to remove and install - hard-to-reach screws/nuts. Oh, and also, the new units (model III?) had slightly different mounting screw positions, requiring some re-drilling of the aluminum mounting plate.
In the end, you'll love the new pumps ... likely for the next 35 years.
 

RCsailfast

E35-3 Illinois
The tank foot pump is supplied from which ever tank you have selected. The feed to the foot pump is teed into the feed line for the electric pump. Before replacing the electric pump it wouldn’t prime if a tank ran empty and would have to use the foot pump to get pressure water system primed.
This is shown on the lower right corner of page 4-3 of the 35-3 owners manual
 
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bsangs

E35-3 - New Jersey
The tank foot pump is supplied from which ever tank you have selected. The feed to the foot pump is teed into the feed line for the electric pump. Before replacing the electric pump it wouldn’t prime if a tank ran empty and would have to use the foot pump to get pressure water system primed.
This is shown on the lower right corner of page 4-3 of the 35-3 owners manual
Good to know, thanks. (Our electric head handles the priming chore when a tank runs dry.)
 

peaman

Sustaining Member
They aren't interchangeable, at least not if re-mounting into the structure that Ericson built under the sink.
It is true that you cannot move the "left-handed" pump to replace the "right-handed" pump. But a left-hand can be reassembled as a right-hand by swapping the front part with the rear part.
 

jtsai

Member III
It is true that you cannot move the "left-handed" pump to replace the "right-handed" pump. But a left-hand can be reassembled as a right-hand by swapping the front part with the rear part.
I did exactly that two years ago when the fresh water foot pump sprung a leak during a cruise. I ended up not installing the rebuilt saltwater foot pump because on the 32-3, there is very little real estate for 2 pump handles, steps, and a pair of feet in front of the little galley sink.
 

bsangs

E35-3 - New Jersey
Update. I feel like a g*****n idiot. There was an inline valve handle that was camouflaged by several crossing hoses. I turned the handle and look at that, cold water flows from the left foot pump, which works perfectly well. It flows through what I assumed was a vent spigot, and not through the main faucet or the saltwater/ice box drain spigot, so it's kind of useless, as that vent spigot hugs the side of the sink. So I'll need to swap it out for a more useful one. Also, when the inline handle is turned and the water pump it active, the water races through the spigot without even touching the foot pump. That doesn't seem like standard operating procedure to me, and if it is, that's unfortunate because we have an electric head, so I like to keep the water pressure active when on-board. Thanks for all the replies everyone. I've filed them away for future pump issues.
 

Chschaus

"Voila"
Update. I feel like a g*****n idiot. There was an inline valve handle that was camouflaged by several crossing hoses. I turned the handle and look at that, cold water flows from the left foot pump, which works perfectly well. It flows through what I assumed was a vent spigot, and not through the main faucet or the saltwater/ice box drain spigot, so it's kind of useless, as that vent spigot hugs the side of the sink. So I'll need to swap it out for a more useful one. Also, when the inline handle is turned and the water pump it active, the water races through the spigot without even touching the foot pump. That doesn't seem like standard operating procedure to me, and if it is, that's unfortunate because we have an electric head, so I like to keep the water pressure active when on-board. Thanks for all the replies everyone. I've filed them away for future pump issues.
On my 35-3 those vent spigots lift up a few inches so they actually can be useful. they are still close to the edge but higher. another faucet sticking out in the small sink I think would be more of a hindrance than a help.
 

bsangs

E35-3 - New Jersey
On my 35-3 those vent spigots lift up a few inches so they actually can be useful. they are still close to the edge but higher. another faucet sticking out in the small sink I think would be more of a hindrance than a help.

I'll see if that's the case for me, thanks. If not, I might just swap spigots, as I don't need the clearance provided from the seawater/icebox spigot on the opposite side.
 

Chschaus

"Voila"
There is a tightening nut at the base, loosen that a bit and it should rise up and down.
That nut is only hand-tight.
 
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