Water seepage into bilge

[jflynn]

Hello,

I bought a 1976 27ft Ericson couple of years ago. I recently noticed very slow water seepage up into the bilge closer to the head. At first I thought it might be seeping out from the keel boats but realized it is an enclosed keel. It appears it has been doing this for years as rust marks show where the water has been draining down into the deeper bilge in the keel to the rear of the boat but it hasn't really been a problem with filling up the bilge prematurely. Can anyone tell me what this hole might be and what is going on here and it is something to be concerned about. And if it is a concern what might be the best course of action for repair. A couple other longtime sailors that looked at it could not give me any advice.

Thank you,

 

[wynkoop]

What is that a photo of? Can you give another shot from further back to give some context or describe where the photo is from?

My E27 has lots of leaks that I have been knocking off over the last several months. On these older boats you can pretty much figure that all the hardware on deck needs to be rebedded. Each time I rebed something I have less water ingress. I also find I have leaks around my windows and rebedding them did not help. I believe I need to replace the rubber.

I get lots of water in the head from the window. I used to get water in there from deck hardware and it would pool behind the wood panel, then pool by the mast support column.

Give a little more context and I will try to help. I will also look at the same place on Silver Maiden when I am on her later this week.

 

[wynkoop]

I also find that water that enters around deck hardware sometimes "surfaces" where you can see it from behind the wood trim, but other times follows the channel back to the aft end of the boat. This has caused rot on my bulkhead at the front of the lazerette. One of my many projects is replacement of the bulkhead.

Sometimes the water will run down on the inside of the hull into the lockers under the seats and I find the water that gets into the head eventually often makes it into the main cabin and down the forward inspection plate into the bilge.

One of the best things I ever did for discovering where I had ingress above the water line was sit in the boat during a hard rain. If you have a helper and are at the dock the same can be done with a hose.

 

[wynkoop]

I almost forgot.....If like mine your boat has the wires to the mast mounted electrics going through the center of the mast step a poor seal around those wires will lead to ingress that will run down either the head bulkhead, the trim over the wires on the the mast support, or INSIDE THE TRIM.
Fixing that issue requires pulling the mast.

I will also note the mast has a tendency to get water inside it. Once I pulled my mast and had a large amount come out. That no longer happens for two reasons. I now have a small crack in the bottom of the mast track from ICE and I drilled weep holes through the mast and step. Water still ends up in there, but much less. I was able to stop the crack by drilling a hole at the end of it just as one would do with plexiglass cracks, I then put a small girdle around the area made from rubber and stainless steel hose clamps. Mast has survived that way even in heavy weather for more than 20 years.

I expect next time I pull the mast I will make some changes to the wire pass through and I may also put in a drain running to the bilge.

 

[jflynn]

Hi wynkoo, this is the only other pic I have at the moment. I pulled up the carpet and the cover to the bilge to expose what looks to be a hole in the fiberglass but it only goes down about 2 inched. What you are looking at is under the cover next to the head. I soaked up the water and watched it fill back up at a very slow rate. I appreciate all your feedback.

 

[bigd14]

That looks like the spot where they attached the lifting eye to the internal lead ballast. There is no keel joint to leak so if it’s coming from inside the keel area that means there is some damage or delamination around the encapsulated lead that is letting water into that area under pressure. Are you sure it is coming up from that threaded hole? Or maybe it’s leaking into the hole from somewhere else in the bilge? If all other leaks ruled out this would be a bit of a mystery.

 

[jflynn]

I'm certain the water is coming up through the threaded hole.

 

[Nick J]

I had the same question on my 25+ with an encapsulated keel. I think bigd14 was even the one who first responded that it was the lifting eye (thanks again!). It was the lowest point I had access to in the bilge and would be the first to fill up. If you look at the whole structure, any water that may enter the keel would show in this hole. I imagine after 40 years of use, the bond between the lead and the inside of the keel wasn't 100% perfect, and the glass over the top of the lead probably had a few spots that lets water in. The result would be a keel with all the little voids filled with water. If you empty that little hole, it would eventually fill up from the water in all the little voids. I thought about drilling holes in the bottom of the keel to let it all out during a haul out, but then I would have holes to repair before splash. During your next haul out, keep an eye on the keel, if there aren't any drips on the outside after it dries out, it isn't coming in from the keel.

 

[jflynn]

I appreciate all the replies. I will pay attention to this when the boat is hauled out. At least for the time being it doesnt look like it needs immediate attention.

 

[wynkoop]

Ok now that I know where it is if you are sure the hole fills up from below, and not from above then I would look for a crack in the keel when hauled.
I would look someplace near the front. One way to find it might be to fill the bilge with water to above the lead and then watch. Just be sure to pump before freezing!

What is the state of the bilge well aft just in front of the engine compartment? If that fills quickly then I would go for a haul now.

The well in front of the engine compartment should be where your bilge pump is located.

When you haul make sure the boat yard knows the back 12 inches of your keel is hollow. One yard that did not listen to my blocking instructions cracked my keel. They did repair it, but I never used them again. When I haul I do not let them block the aft 12 inches of my keel.

 

[jflynn]

Fortunately the bilge well does not fill up quickly. No more than it has for the last couple years. I will definitely look fo the crack when hauled out. I kind of suspect this has been like this for years as the stains around the hole indicate. Thanks for the advise.

 

[Lucky Dog]

I have seepage also...but my boat is on land. I have finally...I Hope fond the leak that has been letting rain water in.
The engine is removed for rebuilding, so I thought I’d clean up the bilge and smooth out the finish. In grind away the high spots, water start seeping...up. I opened up a small area to expose what looks like and like hard styrofoam. Using a shop vac, I removed over a gallon of water.

questions:
Is that foam?
How much of the keel is foam?
Should dig out until dry foam appears?

 

[frick]

Here is my best guess.
My 1971 e29 also has an encapsulated keel. When the boat was being built, Ericson used a steel nuts and bolts to hold everything in place while the laid up the glass. (FYI I think my old e29 was made with right and left half molds.) Once everything is glassed it it stays put. So why spend more money and SS bolts. I think you are looking at the nut that was glassed in the end of the bolt.

Since they are a low spot in the blige water will collect there.