How many Ericson 30+ built?

[Frank Langer]

Does anyone know how many Ericson 30+ were built, and the first and last years in which they were built? I recently bought a 1984, hull #637, and am wondering where that fits in the building cycle for these boats.

Also, I have seen reference to "tall rig" among these boats, but the sales brochure doesn't list tall rig as an option--is there a tall rig model that's different from the standard rig on these boats?
Thanks for any information.
Frank.

 

[tilwinter]

My understanding (from what I have garnered over the years) is that the boat was built until 84 or 85. First boats were 1980 I believe. I have also heard that the first hull number was 501. So yours would be the 137th hull built. There were two drafts, shoal and deep, but I have never seen a "tall rig" version.

 

[Seth]

Late model

Yours would be a later model-I seem to recall hull #'s in the high 600's, but not 700-can anyone confirm this?

There was never a Tall Rig option for the 30+-it only had one rig available in production versions (not counting the masthead rigged 30+ that went around the world).

The Tall Rig you may have seen referenced would have been for the pre 30+ E-30-II-this was a masthead rigged, outboard rudder boat from the which the 30+ evolved. It had a standard and Tall Rig configuration.

Hope this helps!
S

 

[Frank Langer]

Thanks for the responses so far. It's a bit puzzling that there is so relatively little history documented on the Ericsons--various people know bits and pieces, but an overall history doesn't seem to exist. That would make a great project for someone!

I would appreciate any additional information anyone might have about the Ericson 30+. They seem to be very good boats, with few general problems, but as new owner, I would love to hear from others on their experiences, modifications, advice, etc.

Thanks again1

Frank.

 

[therapidone]

E/30+

Greetings Frank,

Some time ago, somebody here provided a document with Ericson Serial Numbers (actually, the correct term is HIN or Hull Identification Number**) on it for all models--at least as were known at the time--or maybe it's a document the Pacific SeaCraft site. Anyway, here's an excerpt from that document:

Still in production by Ericson Yachts in March of 1987
E26 – III # 200 (1984) thru #
E/26 – IV (300 series) # 300 (1987) thru #
E/28 – II # 600 (1985) thru #
E/30 – III # 501 (1979) thru #

As you can see, by the "title" for this subset of models, these were still in production as of 3/87.

** I'm pretty certain that HIN is a different animal from hull number. As you can see in the example above (incidentally, the E/30 - III is a synonym for the E/30+ as it's the last of 3 completely different designs for 30-foot boats manufacutred by Ericson), the HIN that includes 501 as the serial number portion of the HIN would be hull #1 of that design.

Somebody on this forum or Sailnet's email list once referred to CG (Coast Guard) Safety Circular 70, first published in August of 1990 and reprinted in May of 1993, as a primer for decyphering the "hidden" information contained within a HIN. By doing so, I was able to determine that Spirit's serial number is 721, she is an '87 model, and she was either certified or manufactured in October of '86.

Maybe somebody at Pacific SeaCraft knows how many of the E/30+ models were manufactured. Insofar as I know, there are less than a dozen "registered" on owners' sites for the Chesapeake Bay, where I we sail Spirit.

There are sales brochures and spec documents available on this site for the E/30+. From the sales brochure that is available, I was able to determine that the insides of the boats changed over time. The brochure shows fixed, cantilevered steps from the companionway to the sole. Spirit has a detachable, heavy, wooden ladder instead. Also, the brochure shows beige/white/black/reddish-brown plaid upholstery on the cushions; ours are, more or less, a solid, dark blue. The auxillary power is supplied by a Universal, 2-cylinder, diesel, M-18 model...this is "only" rated at 14 hp; whereas, the sales brochure mentions a 16 hp auxillary diesel. Another difference between Spirit and the sales brochure is that the mainsail traveler railing is located on the coach top rather than on the bridge deck. I can't see any signs of its ever having been mounted on the bridge deck so I'm assuming that this was the way it was originally manufactured rather than a modification by a PO. The earlier models of he E/30+ definitely had the traveler on the bridge deck.

Regards,

Ed

 

[therapidone]

Yours would be a later model-I seem to recall hull #'s in the high 600's, but not 700-can anyone confirm this?

Hope this helps!
S

Greetings Seth,

My full HIN is ERY30721J687...with the "721" portion being the serial numbers of interest. This would mean that the #'s did extend into the 700s.

Regards,

Ed

 

[Frank Langer]

Ed,

Thanks for your detailed and helpful reply. I had heard from some other owners about possible changes in the ericson 30+ over time. My 1984 #637 has many of the same modifications that you mentioned--it would be interesting to have a detailed update from someone who worked at the factory during that time, and could provide information on why the various changes were made, and any other information about the 30+ that may not be as visible, in terms of build quality, etc. I know that we have some very knowledgeable people on this board, but I don't know if they worked at the factory during this era.

Thanks again for your reply. Hopefully others will also add to the discussion.

Frank.

 

[Seth]

This shows the 30+ made produced at least through 87. I cannot recall exactly how the Hull #'s info was "coded", but IIRC, your HIN means it was laid up on June 10, 1987-the dates on the #'s refer to when it was laid up in the mold. Not 100%, but I think this is right. I know all the published specs and sail and deck plans show the traveler on the bridgedeck.

At least until PSC took over, I can tell you that the build technique stayed the same-this boat was the prototype for the TAFG structural support system..

I was at the factory for most of the first 3 years this boat was in production, and oversaw all of the custom deck layouts done by the factory (part of my job).

The 30+, introduced in 1979 (right before I was hired) had the mainsheet traveler on the bridgedeck, and most of the early boats were like this. I am pretty sure that the trav was later moved to be more like the other BK E-boats, but I do not remember this during my time. The original engine WAS a 16 hp Univ. 2 cyl diesel. The only reason this changed was a model change by Universal-there is no noticeable difference in performance.

The 30+ is the best all-around boat of the + series boats-
The 28+, introduced in late 80 or early 81 (Model year 1981), is a sawed-off 30+ literally- also had the trav on the bridgedeck, but in later years this was moved to the cabin top.

Feel free to ask any specific questions and I will try to answer them for you.

 

[Frank Langer]

Seth,

Thanks for your additional information. I am not clear whether the 30+ is a successor to the 30-III or is simply another name for the 30-III. How did they arrive at the designation 30+? Most people I mention my boat model to are puzzled as to what the + means--is it larger, more delux, etc. Can you shed any light on that?

Aside from minor tweaks or label changes to the 30+, are you aware of any significant changes that were made to improve the boat during it's production run, or were they pretty confident that they had it "right" and simply kept building more of them? Did the TAFG system stand up the way they expected? (I am always a bit leery about being the "guinea pig" on new innovations that may not prove as good in reality as they looked on the design table).

I have heard lots of positives about the 30+ -- enough that I recently bought a 1984, hull #637, but haven't had enough experience with her yet to know if they really are as good as their reputation--any comments? Any inherent weaknesses to watch for? Or modifications that should definitely be done?

Thanks for any additional information you can provide.

Frank.

 

[Seth]

All good questions

Frank-you have a great boat. The 30+ evolved from the 30-II in that the hull mold was used with minor modifications to the stern section, and the structure was changed (TAFG), but we used most of the old tooling from the 30-II to make a more modern 30 footer. The same thing was done with the 25+, but to a lesser degree. Not much was used from the old tooling, but until the 28+ showed up, it was the way we identified the new current models of the same length as older models. The 28+ was designed along the same thinking as the 30+ and 25+ that although there was never a straight 28 previously, we named it the + series. In reality, it was not as logical as you might have hoped. The straight 28 came later.

By the way, I have never, ever, heard of a 30-III. The first time was in the post in this thread. If there ever was such a boat, it must have been the latest version of this hull shape from PSC with only minor upgrades, but I do not think it ever existed as an E-boat. Certainly not in my time or the 10 years after I left, but was still in the industry and in touch with Ericson.

The 30 foot lineage as I know it is the original 1960's 30 footer (sometimes called a 30-1), the 30 and 30-II (Bruce King, outboard rudder boat with MH rig, which was used as the tooling for the 30+), there were some upgrades with the -II designation-mostly a tall rig I think, then the 30+ in 1979- MAYBE the + designation was dropped by PSC in the last years-similar to what was done with the 28+, which later became simply the 28 with minor mods. But no 30-III by Ericson.

Beyond some very minor changes, perhaps the traveler location, there were very few significant changes. They DID have it right from the get-go. The TAFG was good enough that it became the standard method for all subsequent E-boats, so I would say it works pretty well.

Build quality was good with a few lemons-but they have long since been sorted out (laid up on late friday afternoon-if you know what I mean).

Nothing special about the 30+ to watch out for in quality. She is very fast for a cruiser, close winded and powerful. This means she is a bit tender, and if you sail in winds frequently over 12-15 knots I would use a headsail of 110-125% as your normal headsail-this is too much for a 150% genny (upwind, of course). The narrow stern means less speed and comfort in HEAVY AIR reaching, but for day sailing or coatal cruising this is no concern, and as long as you get the sail down to the right size in these conditions you are fine. The only thing is that a similar sized boat with a more powerful stern section would be faster in these conditions..BUT not as fast upwind and especially in light-medium breeze-everything is a trade off.

The Ericson history, while spotty in parts, is better than most builders of the day. Columbia, Islander, Cal Yachts, etc. all had somewhat bizarre record keeping (we were just getting copy machines back then!) and marketing strategies-the marketing guys came and went, and so did some of the logic. Ericson did better than most.

You have a good, well documented (by industry standards) boat-enjoy!!

S

 

[Frank Langer]

Seth,
Thanks for your detailed, and reassuring reply. We are very excited about our new boat, and eager to get to know her better and sail in various winds and conditions. We will be sailing her in the Gulf Islands off Vancouver Island, and in the Strait of Georgia--very beautiful sailing areas.
Thanks again!
Frank.

 

[Meanolddad]

I agree with Seth on most of his observations. Our 30+ came with a 150 which overpowered the boat in most conditions. We bought a used sail that is probably a 120 and the boat is much happier. The mainsail is quite large and powerfull. I have never been on a boat with such a low boom. You have to be quite carefull and mindfull of the boom. Think powerfull, not tender.

There were some changes to the 30+ over the production run. Mostly just details. The traveller was moved to the top of the cabin house. Tinted plexiglass companion way hatch instead of fiberglass, removable ladder to get below, a removable engine cover, folding leaf table, and less wood below. I would love to get a copy of a later brochure than the one on this website. Regalus is hull number 698 and splashed in late 1994 and is considered a 1985 year model. The interior has some changes. Regalus is a very stock boat to this day. Tiller, no shore power, no hot water, no pressure water, very simple. It does sail really well. We all have to keep in mind that these boat were somewhat custom ordered with the options that the customer wanted.

Greg

 

[Seth]

Regalus rocks

Well, If I were to have a 30+, I would have the tiller just like you! The one thing I have ever liked is wheel steering on little boats-especially boats with tiny sterns; I always imagined it was like steering with handcuffs with such a little wheel.:0305_alar :0305_alar

I know this is a personal bias, but the better responsiveness, control, and weight placement gains that come with a tiller on this boat are very much worth it.

With respect to the low boom-this has nothing to do with the design of the boat-it is a function of one or both of 2 possible factors: the first is too much aft rake in the tune of the mast(headstay a bit too long). This will have the effect of lowering the boom, maybe too much. The other is a mainsail whose leech is simply too long. Normal cruising mains should have a tack angle of 88-89 degrees-slightly less than perpendicular-this helps with cockpit headroom and a possible dodger clearance issue. Racing mains typically have 90-91 degrees-slightly lower boom, bigger sail. It is possible your sail has a bigger than usual tack angle (which means longer leech length) for who knows what reason-a mistake maybe-or that your mast has too much rake, or both.

The point is this boat does NOT have a low boom by design, and this is easily corrected by a). checking the rig tune, and/or b). a trip to the sailmaker to have the clew rasied.

Otherwise, you are 100% right on all observations.

Cheers,

S

 

[Meanolddad]

E30+ Low Boom

Hey Seth
I do not know if a couple of degrees would help our boom situation. It seems pretty low compared to the boats that we owned prior to Regalus. We sailed Regalus for 3 months and went to do a seatrial on our Oday 240 prior to selling it, the boom seemed really high compared to Regulas, almost standing room. Also all the other boat that I have sailed on lately seem to have a much higher boom. Where the boom mounts to the mast seems higher, at least a foot or two. Who knows what prior owners have done to the boat also. Putting a dodger on Regalus would be nice, it would have to be a pretty short dodger though. A dodger is on the to do list. There is no way to put a bimini on the boat though. I do have the original sail plan blue print for the boat. I will check if the boom measures the right height off the cabin roof the next time we are down at the boat.
Regalus is the nicest sailing and best built boat we have owned, would not trade it for any other, meets all out sailing needs to a T.
Greg

 

[Seth]

Still can be fixed

Hey Greg,

It would be very surprising if your gooseneck were too low. IIRC, the P meaurement on this boat is 38 or 38.5 feet (full hoist on the main halyard to a line even with the top of the boom). It should be in the specs, but this is close.

I know other 30+ owners will chime in eventually, but this is not a universal problem. Many, many of these have real dodgers, and I have seen some with Biminis, too.

Unless you have a "long" or oversized P dimension, it is either too much rake or too long a leech, or both. Does your sail have a flattening reef point? This is a clew (only) reef piont anywhere from 10-15 inches up from the clew. They used to be very common on racing sails, but are no longer in much favor. Sails more than 6-7 yeasr old will often have them. If you have one, try it-it will raise the boom up accordingly and see if that is enough. If not, you can always have your sailmaker make the clew patch larger and install a "new" clew ring up to about 15-18" max., and re-fair the foot-if the rig is ok in terms of rake, this should do the trick.

Now, if this still does not sound like what you are seeing, take a photo of the boat sailing-preferably from the side, and, and I can see how much droop your boom has. If the shot is taken from a hundred feet away, I can likely see the rake as well. You might try letting the main halyard shackle fall straight down to the deck (no wind, boat level on its' lines of course). If the shackle hits the deck more than about 3 inches aft of the back side of the mast, you have too much rake...take up on the headstay (ease the backstay accordingly if need be) to correct this.

If you find the boat has a lot of weather helm-big tug when pressed-this indicates a lot of rake.With your 120 up, in about 15 knots of breeze, if you are sailing upwind with everything trimmed right, you should be able to let go of the tiller and the boat will SLOWLY round up towards the wind. If it rounds right up, or you feel a lot of tug in this condition, I suspect too much aft rake.

Jes' trying ta help....you have too sweet a boat to be frustrated with something that should not be an issue.
BTW-I never saw an updated brochure from the one on the 30+ on this site. Maybe they did make a new one, but I never saw it.
Keep us posted,
S

 

[Meanolddad]

Hey Seth
My comment about the boom was more of an observation than a complaint. The mainsail is less than 4 years old and it does have a flattening reef. It is a full batten large roach loose footed main. Regalus came with a 150 genoa and the large main. I think the second owner was convinced that more sail equals faster. The original owner had a couple of headsails that were probably worn out. I would still like to have given them a try. When I do get a new headsail I am probably going to go with a 135, With the 120 up in 15 knots of wind the boat has just a touch of weather helm, and slowly rounds up into the wind if the helm is released. We sail out of San Pedro CA and are berthed in the local Hurricane Gulch. When it is 12-15 knots out of the harbor it is probably 25+ in the gulch. We do get considerable weather helm in those conditions but the boat is in complete control, even when the rail is under. I will check the mast rake and see what it is like and sail with the flattening reef just to check.
Regalus is the sweetest sailing boat we have owned and we are very happy with it. Regalus is quite easy to sail fast and points beautifully. No complaints here.
Greg

 

[Graham Cole]

I have hull 635- an 84 30+ and I raised the boom 10 inches with a new north full batten main/ solid vang. This gave me headroom and a nice dodger. I would only replace her with a 38-200 if I could get a bigger slip! Great boat!
G.

 

[Seth]

I hear ya!

Hi Greg,

I'm with you 100%-it never sounded that way, but it did sound like you were wondering if this were a "trait" or design aspect/flaw in the design, and I wanted to clear this up-it is something about the way your boat is set up that is causing it...

And, by your description of the sail and its' age, I will bet it does have some droop to the boom (bigger than typical tack angle for a cruising boat mainsail, which means a longer leech-BTW, do not confuse "tack angle" with "tacking angle"). If you have any more than about 10 true and plan on doing some upwind sailing, use the flattener. This should get the boom up considerably, and it will be faster upwind, and on all points once the breeze is in the high teens (except very broad reaching or running). If you like this boom height a lot more, you can have the sail altered accordingly.

Yes, it IS a sweet sailing boat, and I will bet that by your description of how she sails in the " 'gulch ", the rake is close to being right.

Keep in mind that while the boat tracks straight and always seems in control when sailing hard in those conditions, that weather helm is REALLY slowing you down from rudder drag-caused by having the rudder (aka "water brake") always being at a large angle. Indirect performance losses also include too much leeway (keel not pointing down), speed loss from a heeled hull shape rather than one with 8-12 degrees which is about optimal. The boat will be faster, more comfortable, controllable and safer if you can keep her more upright.

As cool as those photos look of boats heeled way over, this is a terrible way to sail-it is in fact slower all the way around. Rail down is never . I would call it more :nerd: Keep in mind, also, that you have very poor visbility when heeled way over-not .

Having said all that-this is probably too basic and I apologize if this sounds like a lecture-I can tell you are having a ball with a great boat, and that is what this is all about. My :nerd: obsession is helping folks get the most enjoyment, safety and performance from their boats..

See you round campus!

S

 

[therapidone]

By the way, I have never, ever, heard of a 30-III. The first time was in the post in this thread. If there ever was such a boat, it must have been the latest version of this hull shape from PSC with only minor upgrades, but I do not think it ever existed as an E-boat. Certainly not in my time or the 10 years after I left, but was still in the industry and in touch with Ericson.

The 30 foot lineage as I know it is the original 1960's 30 footer (sometimes called a 30-1), the 30 and 30-II (Bruce King, outboard rudder boat with MH rig, which was used as the tooling for the 30+), there were some upgrades with the -II designation-mostly a tall rig I think, then the 30+ in 1979- MAYBE the + designation was dropped by PSC in the last years-similar to what was done with the 28+, which later became simply the 28 with minor mods. But no 30-III by Ericson.
S

When I excerpted the applicable portion of the document containing Ericson serial numbers in the earlier post, I indicated that the "30 - III" was a synonym for the "E/30+". In a "draft" version of that posting, I had written that the "30 - III" was an "incorrect designation" for the "E/30+" and then felt that such prhasing may have been a bit too judgmental. Somebody went to the trouble of doing research on the Ericson serial numbers to put that document together. I do not believe that it was an official corporate document. However, since the earlier Ericson 30-foot models were designated 30 - I, and 30 - II, I could understand how one might take the third 30-foot model and designate it 30 - III instead of its rightful name, "E/30+".

As has already been noted here, I have never seen any official literature referring to the model as a "30 - III." I hope this clears up some of the confusion.

Regards,

Ed

 

[therapidone]

I have never tried attaching a document at this site before; I am hopeful that this will work...if so, please find attached Coast Guard Safety Circular 70, which includes HIN101 or "How I learned to decypher and love Hull Identification Numbers!"
View attachment CG_Sfty_Crclr_70_HINs.pdf