We just got back from a great three week cruise on our E 39-B from San Francisco to Southern California and back. The boat performed quite well in varying states of sea and wind, and nothing broke!! However ... these creaking bulkheads are driving me crazy. When we get powered up in any kind of bumpy seaway it gets fairly noisy down below. How common is this situation? I don't recall it being an issue with my last boat - a Morgan 32. In particular the walls around the head seem to be the biggest offender. It seems like it would be a huge ordeal to retab these walls. Any thoughts or comments?
Creaky Bulkheads/Furniture
- Thread starter boatboy
- Start date
u079721
Contributing Partner
Our 38 creaked too
I have wondered about this too, as the cabin of our E-38 was also alive with creaks when we were in big seas. You couldn't hear it from topsides though, so I can't really say whether my friends sailboats do the same. In our case the creaks didn't sound as if they were coming from the bulkheads, which in any case were all still soundly (no pun intended...) tabbed to the hull. Rather the creaks all seemed to be from the cabin furniture seams rubbing as the boat flexed going through the waves. We didn't usually find it that annoying, but it could get loud at times for the off-watch crew.
Ericsons are a bit unusual for production boats in having cabins that were entirely (mostly?) built up from wood, rather than being one big fiberglass pan. In boats where the cabin is a fiberglass pan you wouldn't have these wood seams to rub and creak when the boat flexed. Of course that is assuming that all boats flex a bit in a seaway. Do they? Again I can't say about other boats, but ours sure did.
I have wondered about this too, as the cabin of our E-38 was also alive with creaks when we were in big seas. You couldn't hear it from topsides though, so I can't really say whether my friends sailboats do the same. In our case the creaks didn't sound as if they were coming from the bulkheads, which in any case were all still soundly (no pun intended...) tabbed to the hull. Rather the creaks all seemed to be from the cabin furniture seams rubbing as the boat flexed going through the waves. We didn't usually find it that annoying, but it could get loud at times for the off-watch crew.
Ericsons are a bit unusual for production boats in having cabins that were entirely (mostly?) built up from wood, rather than being one big fiberglass pan. In boats where the cabin is a fiberglass pan you wouldn't have these wood seams to rub and creak when the boat flexed. Of course that is assuming that all boats flex a bit in a seaway. Do they? Again I can't say about other boats, but ours sure did.
NateHanson
Sustaining Member
Could owners of other Ericson models comment on this issue? I haven't noticed the same thing in a Hinckley or Sabre offshore, and those both had entirely wooden joinerwork, not a fiberglass pan.
I'd be a bit concerned if the creaking were due to the hull flexing substantially. I'd like to know if other Ericson owners have noticed this in steep conditions.
Nate
I'd be a bit concerned if the creaking were due to the hull flexing substantially. I'd like to know if other Ericson owners have noticed this in steep conditions.
Nate
Geoff Johnson
Fellow Ericson Owner
I have been impressed with the lack of any noticeable movement in my boat. I could be wrong, but I think the 32-3 is the only model of Mark III series to have all of its shrouds attached to the TFG. From the pictures I have seen, the larger models seem to have one or more shrouds attached to a wooden bulkhead. Also, having replaced the glued down cabin sole, the TFG on my model probably covers aboput 2/3rds of the surface area of the sole. That ratio appears to be less as the models increase in size.
Hi,
This is my first full season with Emerald (bought her last October), so while I don't have extensive experience with her, I've been out in some stuff blowing around 20 with 3 to 4 foot waves. She has been completely quite down below. That said, she is an entirely different construction than the TFG in the later Ericsons, but she has extensive wood work below. Check the Photos section of my website for some interior shots to see what I am talking about:
http://home.comcast.net/~independence31
-David
Independence 31
Emerald
This is my first full season with Emerald (bought her last October), so while I don't have extensive experience with her, I've been out in some stuff blowing around 20 with 3 to 4 foot waves. She has been completely quite down below. That said, she is an entirely different construction than the TFG in the later Ericsons, but she has extensive wood work below. Check the Photos section of my website for some interior shots to see what I am talking about:
http://home.comcast.net/~independence31
-David
Independence 31
Emerald
NateHanson
Sustaining Member
Great looking boat David! 
Cory B
Sustaining Member
Similar Creaks?
We get some "creaks" as well in our '75 E32. Although smaller than your 39, I wonder if it uses the same construction techniques... The bulkheads are glassed in on the bottom and sides, but not tops, where they fit into a groove. Most of the creaking I hear can be traced to the tops, where I suspect the deck and bulkheads are rubbing against each other.
We only hear the creaks if we are in a real swell, or just after a tack in strong winds as the boat settles into its new groove.
This last spring I added some additional glass, and a few screws to strengthen the bulkheads in preparation for our sailing trip North. I don't think it made any real difference in the audible creaking. I'm not really worried about it.
As an aside, we sailed her back from the Puget Sound area to Portland a few weeks ago, and she handled it beautifully (of course). Now if I can just figure out where to mount the anti-fog machine....
- Cory Bolton
We get some "creaks" as well in our '75 E32. Although smaller than your 39, I wonder if it uses the same construction techniques... The bulkheads are glassed in on the bottom and sides, but not tops, where they fit into a groove. Most of the creaking I hear can be traced to the tops, where I suspect the deck and bulkheads are rubbing against each other.
We only hear the creaks if we are in a real swell, or just after a tack in strong winds as the boat settles into its new groove.
This last spring I added some additional glass, and a few screws to strengthen the bulkheads in preparation for our sailing trip North. I don't think it made any real difference in the audible creaking. I'm not really worried about it.
As an aside, we sailed her back from the Puget Sound area to Portland a few weeks ago, and she handled it beautifully (of course). Now if I can just figure out where to mount the anti-fog machine....
- Cory Bolton
Creaking...
Hey Greg,
Glad you guys are safely back. My 38 doesent make any creaking noises but ironically my Morgan 416 is very noisy in big swells. I did isolate the bulkhead that makes the noise and ended up squirting silicone into the cracks at the joints. I found that it only takes very little movement between the wood surface and the gelcoat to make an irritating squeak that can drive you mad if you are below. I had some success with tapping little plastic wedges into the spaces i could get to. This seemed to keep the two surfaces apart enough to keep the noise down.
BTW
We are heading out to the Farralons on the 15th for a little Great White watching for the day. I think slack water is around 6:30am at the GG
Hey Greg,
Glad you guys are safely back. My 38 doesent make any creaking noises but ironically my Morgan 416 is very noisy in big swells. I did isolate the bulkhead that makes the noise and ended up squirting silicone into the cracks at the joints. I found that it only takes very little movement between the wood surface and the gelcoat to make an irritating squeak that can drive you mad if you are below. I had some success with tapping little plastic wedges into the spaces i could get to. This seemed to keep the two surfaces apart enough to keep the noise down.
BTW
We are heading out to the Farralons on the 15th for a little Great White watching for the day. I think slack water is around 6:30am at the GG
Creaky?
Of course the 39-B (cool boat!) is built completely differently than the TAFG boats, and is not as stiff a hull (but fine just the same)-so the whole hull WILL work in a seaway, and you WILL hear some noise. It would be worth double checking to make sure all the bulkheads are securely bonded-I think they will be, but it is worth a look.
The newer boats have one of the stiffest, flex-free hulls in the biz-but the interiors, while partially anchored to the grid, are also attached to less well supported parts of the hull, and some of them will groan and creak. On any TAFG boat I would not worry much about this-unless it were extreme-and even then I think it would still not be a hull structural problem, but a furniture bonding issue.
As great as the E-boats are, they are not Hinckley's or even Sabre's. Those boats were MUCH more expensive and were built (albeit heavily) in kind.
Stay tuned-I know I will!
S
Of course the 39-B (cool boat!) is built completely differently than the TAFG boats, and is not as stiff a hull (but fine just the same)-so the whole hull WILL work in a seaway, and you WILL hear some noise. It would be worth double checking to make sure all the bulkheads are securely bonded-I think they will be, but it is worth a look.
The newer boats have one of the stiffest, flex-free hulls in the biz-but the interiors, while partially anchored to the grid, are also attached to less well supported parts of the hull, and some of them will groan and creak. On any TAFG boat I would not worry much about this-unless it were extreme-and even then I think it would still not be a hull structural problem, but a furniture bonding issue.
As great as the E-boats are, they are not Hinckley's or even Sabre's. Those boats were MUCH more expensive and were built (albeit heavily) in kind.
Stay tuned-I know I will!
S
Thanks for the replies. As I mentioned, the major squeak comes from the walls around the head. I am not sure if it is due to the walls rubbing on the fiberglass floor insert or on the deck/hull. To really get a good look it seems that I would have to remove a number of trim pieces, which would mean removing and then replacing a bunch of bungs. Doing this work so it looks as good as new when I am done is not in my current skill set. Maybe I just need to learn how to do this sort of thing nicely.
Of course the issue is not just this squeak. It is also the rumbling of water and diesel around the baffles in their tanks as well as a mast squeak that I have not yet been able to localize (though I'm now focusing on the mast partners). When we are sailing in rolly/windy/bouncy conditions in the opean ocean this adds up to a Devil's Symphony for the off-watch trying to get some sleep. So far ear plugs are the best solution.
This is our only real complaint about the boat. She did fantastic on the trip overall, including dealing with a fairly windy/wavey beat around Pt. Sur.
Of course the issue is not just this squeak. It is also the rumbling of water and diesel around the baffles in their tanks as well as a mast squeak that I have not yet been able to localize (though I'm now focusing on the mast partners). When we are sailing in rolly/windy/bouncy conditions in the opean ocean this adds up to a Devil's Symphony for the off-watch trying to get some sleep. So far ear plugs are the best solution.
This is our only real complaint about the boat. She did fantastic on the trip overall, including dealing with a fairly windy/wavey beat around Pt. Sur.
Suspect Tabbing?
A 39B we took a 39 (Same Hull) 40,000 Miles + around the south pacific. Great sailing boats.
I almost have the wiring done on my 1972 Ericson 46.
Pneuma the 39, did't make all that much noise when sailing, a little here and there, but not all that much. Wouldn't have kept me awake offshore in any case. (The olive oil in the galley stores rolling back and forth was much worse, as were the plates in the plate holder ticking back that forth. Those refrences are to give you an idea of noise level.)
The early boats are notorious (39's and 46's included) for having the tabbing poorly attached. If you want to see how poorly go here. www.svpneuma.com click on any of the tabbing links etc.... (My site, my boat...) It was early in the build process of FRP boats, and there was quite a lot that they didn't know, or hadn't worked out yet. One of the things being that Polyester doesn't bond to cured polyester very well. Also they tended to have really large gaps between the bulkheads and the hull +4 inches in some cases, which creates some really strange situations with the tabbing being bonded to itself through the gap.......
I have been involved in three retabbing projects on 39's and one complete retabbing project on a 46.
So here is the offer. Aiki (The 46), is just about rewired, 4 wires left. From the web site you can see what we have done etc. If you want to look at how it all goes together, and you can come this weekend, (Before I start headliner next week), you can take a look at what we did, and the before and after photos, I also have a few tips for deciding if the tabbing has failed on the head bulkheads. Since you would only have to drive to Alameda, it might find it worth the trip to come and look at what it looks like with nothing on it.
Guy Stevens,
Slave and Captain of
SV AIKI
Ericson 46
A 39B we took a 39 (Same Hull) 40,000 Miles + around the south pacific. Great sailing boats.
I almost have the wiring done on my 1972 Ericson 46.
Pneuma the 39, did't make all that much noise when sailing, a little here and there, but not all that much. Wouldn't have kept me awake offshore in any case. (The olive oil in the galley stores rolling back and forth was much worse, as were the plates in the plate holder ticking back that forth. Those refrences are to give you an idea of noise level.)
The early boats are notorious (39's and 46's included) for having the tabbing poorly attached. If you want to see how poorly go here. www.svpneuma.com click on any of the tabbing links etc.... (My site, my boat...) It was early in the build process of FRP boats, and there was quite a lot that they didn't know, or hadn't worked out yet. One of the things being that Polyester doesn't bond to cured polyester very well. Also they tended to have really large gaps between the bulkheads and the hull +4 inches in some cases, which creates some really strange situations with the tabbing being bonded to itself through the gap.......
I have been involved in three retabbing projects on 39's and one complete retabbing project on a 46.
So here is the offer. Aiki (The 46), is just about rewired, 4 wires left. From the web site you can see what we have done etc. If you want to look at how it all goes together, and you can come this weekend, (Before I start headliner next week), you can take a look at what we did, and the before and after photos, I also have a few tips for deciding if the tabbing has failed on the head bulkheads. Since you would only have to drive to Alameda, it might find it worth the trip to come and look at what it looks like with nothing on it.
Guy Stevens,
Slave and Captain of
SV AIKI
Ericson 46
Guy,
Thanks for the great offer. I would love to take you up on it, but I'm not sure if I'll be available. More likely than not, we are supposed to be doing a Drake's Bay cruise this weekend. If we get back in time on Sunday, or the whole thing get's bagged, I will definitely swing by.
If possible, please send me a private email with your cell phone so I can get in touch. Thanks again.
Thanks for the great offer. I would love to take you up on it, but I'm not sure if I'll be available. More likely than not, we are supposed to be doing a Drake's Bay cruise this weekend. If we get back in time on Sunday, or the whole thing get's bagged, I will definitely swing by.
If possible, please send me a private email with your cell phone so I can get in touch. Thanks again.