Basics: Where is a reliable/quality/fair-priced source for filters? (M40)

[JP in Sandusky]

The new-to-me boat (1988 38-200) has an M40 engine. Because we have to relocate the boat, she will be winterized early...next week.

I expect I can purchase the oil, oil filter, fuel filter, impellor, and other maintenance items from the shipyard. That said.....is there a good online source that I can trust to send the correct items at a fair price?

Also, how do I confirm if this is an M40 vs an M40B? I have downloaded the Universal Owners Manual located here (THANK YOU!). I am no stranger to performing basic mechanical tasks. I am just uncertain on where to source the basics.

Lastly: If the boat was used for <10 engine hours all year, should I bother with an oil change this fall? I wouldn't dream of changing the oil on my Kubota tractor after that little use, but the tractor never sits for 7 months straight either.

(As it is, I am going to be flushing red anti-freeze out of the plumbing system next week....just to put new red anti-freeze in the system. Seems silly, but I don't want to risk the system over $20 and an hour of my time.)

 

[Christian Williams]

A Universal M40B uses the Kubota V1305 diesel engine block, which is different from the V1501 or V1502 blocks used in other Universal models like the 5432 or M40. You can find the specific Kubota engine model by checking the serial number tag on the engine's valve cover.

On my 5432, the Kubota serial number is stamped on the engine block near the fuel injector pump.

No need to change the oil after 10 hours, seems to me. But it's a new boat, so I would. You never know where other people's oil has been.

 

[peaman]

For oil and oil and fuel filters, I developed a list of compatible model numbers, or specifications, and I get them from a nearby auto parts supplier (NAPA). For marine-specific parts, like raw water impeller, I will check Fisheries Supply first.

 

[toddster]

The cost of filters seems high, especially within walking distance of moorages. And for a while, I was going through a lot of fuel filters. (IIRC, I bought every one in the store at Westport and Crescent City.) I feel the need to stock up every time I'm back at home base.

I find the usual on-line mega-markets have a lot of no-name knock-offs of my usual filters for half the price. I mean they look identical in color and labeling, except the brand name is left off. You might miss it if you just did a quick search and picked the best price.

So they raise my ire a bit with obviously deceptive marketing, but I really don't know about the quality. I'd be curious to know if anyone has experience with these. But how would we know if they're performing well or not? For all we know, they could be made by the same contractor, on the same factory line. But so far, I haven't felt it was worth the risk.
Examples:

 

[JP in Sandusky]

I found a July 2023 post here from @David Grimm that mentions the m40 in the 38-200 will fit a WIX 51068. I bought one, and I'll give it the old eyeball before I take the old one off. If it doesn't seem correct, I'll buy one from the local shop. The manual indicates 30 weight oil, but most everyone seems to be fine with 15-w40. I purchased non-synthetic 15-40 from TSC. I have seen zinc additive mentioned on that post and a couple of other places, I am not familiar with that or what it is for.

Please tell me if the below schedule is reasonable for a newbie.

I am setting aside one day for
- pulling off the sails and folding them (first time)
- removing the running rigging (first time)
- seafoam and half fill the tanks with clean fuel

I have, for the second day of decommissioning:
- winterize head, shower, tanks, and system
- oil change
- winterize the engine
- tape cabinets, doors, etc.

Day 3 / de-mast day (and move off the boat):
- removing the boom (first time)
- prepping/loosening the shrouds for the the mast to come down
- disconnecting mast wiring
- step back, watch the yard pull the mast
- remove spreaders, prepare mast for truck (with yard help)
- tape hatches, lockers, and mast "hole"

My inexperienced opinion is that this is quite a bit to get done, but achievable. We close on the purchase on Monday, but the boat has to come out of the water by Friday. (Again, we live 13 hours away from Lake Champlain. Kids are back in school. Fall sports are in full swing.)

It is a bummer, but it is very likely that Tuesday will be the only day we will sail and play. The rest of the week looks like we need to stay focused on getting everything home and stored in proper condition. I know there is another month left in the season, but I can't justify splashing her in Lake Erie for 2-3 weeks.

I am still, though, quite happy!

 

[peaman]

Of course, you will be putting in messenger lines as you remove the running rigging, to facilitate reinstallation in the Spring, right?

Since it sounds like you have a tight schedule, I would allow an additional day to your three days to allow for your unfamiliarity with systems and procedures.

Also, take care to document, label, and tag everything so you will have notes and pictures to refer to when time comes to put it all back together.

 

[gabriel]

- seafoam and half fill the tanks with clean fuel

Why half fill? I was always under the impression that tanks are suppose to be topped off in order to avoid condensation during storage?

 

[Christian Williams]

Often recommended. For me, that would mean carrying around 55 gallons, some of it for years at a burn of .6 gal/hour.

I have not seen issues with half full. As I recall, Maine Sail, R.C. Collins, disputes the claims of danger by condensation.

 

[Prairie Schooner]

Off season Tank 'fillage'
If the condensation is even a thing, could you just tape off the vent?

 

[Kenneth K]

If the condensation is even a thing, could you just tape off the vent?

It is a thing. It's why we used to add HEET to car gas tanks before ethanol came along (alcohol in the ethanol now absorbs the moisture). Air in the tank contains the same amount of moisture as the outside air (depends on relative humidity). As the tank cools down at night, the cooler air can't contain as much moisture, so water condenses on the cool tank walls and runs to the bottom of the tank.

Thus the recommendation to fill your tank before storage. Less air in the tank means less moisture to condense.

You can't seal the vent because there's always some air in the tank and fill lines, and the air needs to vent as it expands and contracts with fluctuations in the outside air temperature.

 

[JP in Sandusky]

Regarding filling the tank: It was about 60% when we left her this morning. When trucking, some truckers want it empty, some just want to be sure it isn't completely full. So, I added some seafoam and left it partially full. I might top off when I go see her in Buffalo, after the trucking is complete. I have to check things and pull batteries, etc at that time anyway.

I have two different Kubota diesels in tractors, and we leave them at least half full every winter. Those are plastic tanks, though, and we typically run the tractors for snow removal or something 4-6 weeks in the winter time.

 

[Sidnewport]

For oil and oil and fuel filters, I developed a list of compatible model numbers, or specifications, and I get them from a nearby auto parts supplier (NAPA). For marine-specific parts, like raw water impeller, I will check Fisheries Supply first.

OK, how do you get a list of compatible filters? I am having difficulty getting filters for my Universal m-12. The manual has Universal part numbers, but I can't find a list of compatible replacements. I seems like a pretty basic engine (if old), so you would not think it would be very hard.

 

[Loren Beach]

Recalling when we first bought our boat it came with several spare different oil filters. They were of varying labels. The good news was that they would thread onto the Universal M25XP. Some research showed that on our engine they protruded a bit too far, and what was a near-miss with the alternator bracket would have them rubbing on it.

My takeaway was that while there were several that would indeed screw onto the Kubota block, you have to be careful about clearance with periferals that might be different than the tractor applications for that same block. Admittedly I might be overly cautious.
So, do check on suitable alternate brands, but don't assume an interference-free fit.
(What with changing out the lube oil and filter once a year, I decided that there was too few $ to potentially save, so I stuck with the factory offering. )

 

[Pete the Cat]

Often recommended. For me, that would mean carrying around 55 gallons, some of it for years at a burn of .6 gal/hour.

I have not seen issues with half full. As I recall, Maine Sail, R.C. Collins, disputes the claims of danger by condensation.

I don't know about Collins, but back in the day I had an off line disagreement with MainSail about his testing process for his article.I have been storing my tank full for the last decade through a winter and never had water in the bottom of the tank--I sump it bi annually to check as Nigel Calder recommends. I suppose that could mean it would not form if the tank was partially filled. But I generally burn 50 gallons a season so I have good turnover in my 50 gallon tank.

 

[peaman]

OK, how do you get a list of compatible filters?

An Internet search something like "filter cross reference universal diesel" should result in some useful links. Also, any good auto parts store, Napa for example, should be able to take most any filter part number and find compatible equivalents. This is true for any type of filter: oil, air, fuel.

 

[Loren Beach]

Back at least a decade ago, IIRC, someone here posted up the result of acetone-scrubbing off the Universal-Westerbeke paint overlay from their filter (might have been used on an M25 or an M25XP) and reported that the filter was either a Fram/ Baldwin/Wix product. I do not recall exact name & part number, however.

 

[Bolo]

Beware of faulty filters! I posted this before but in light of this subject it deserves repeating. I once purchased a Universal oil filter for my M25XP from a reputable marine engine parts store in Annapolis and discovered to my dismay that there were no threads cut into the oil filter making screwing it into the engine an impossibility. Here’s the link for that posting: https://ericsonyachts.org/ie/threads/fuel-filter-warning.21499/

 

[Sidnewport]

An Internet search something like "filter cross reference universal diesel" should result in some useful links. Also, any good auto parts store, Napa for example, should be able to take most any filter part number and find compatible equivalents. This is true for any type of filter: oil, air, fuel.

 

[Sidnewport]

Thanks,I was able to find a list, with hundreds of choices. I don't know why my local auto place couldnt find anything for either oil or fuel.

 

[Joliba]

For what it’s worth, our 1988 E38-200 has a Universal 5432 engine with a 1502 block. We use a NAPA Gold 1068 oil filter and a NAPA Gold 3390 for the fuel filter on the engine. (The primary fuel filter element depends upon what model filter you have. We installed a Racor 500 series filter and use an appropriate filter.)
For winterizing in Waukegan, IL, we fill the tank almost full. If it is topped off, fuel sometimes leaks out the air vent over the winter if the yard positions the boat stern down a bit too much. We put Biobor in the tank to prevent growth. We don’t generally add Stabil or Heet.