e 31 c
- Thread starter tommy h
- Start date
What are you trying to accomplish
What are you trying to accomplish by making these changes.
Normally a cutter rig has the mast position in a different location to maintain a balanced CE. (Center of Effort).
I don't have the sail plans for the different rigs for this hull, but normally the sloop is going to have a taller mast, rigged aft of the cutters mast location. All in all generally the sloop is going to out sail the cutter. The concept of a cutter rig dates to differences in cloth and the reduction in weight of individual sails to aid in sail handling.
With a modern roller furling the need for a smaller head sail is greatly reduced, as the larger headsail with a longer leading edge improves windward ability. This given that the boat is also a modest 31 feet, the division of the sails versus the loss of windward ability seems a poor trade off to me. (All things being equal, and assuming that the mast height and position are different between the two).
If your concern is sailing on the bay, having a correctly designed roller furling sail of the correct size would make the boat sail safe and well on the bay. If your goal is farther afield where you may encounter gale force winds and steep seas, then I would recommend the addition of a solent stay for heavy weather work. This would eliminate the need for running backstays that are common in a cutter rig, would cost significantly less to install, and would keep the boat preforming better and be easier to sail, especially short handed.
Guy
What are you trying to accomplish by making these changes.
Normally a cutter rig has the mast position in a different location to maintain a balanced CE. (Center of Effort).
I don't have the sail plans for the different rigs for this hull, but normally the sloop is going to have a taller mast, rigged aft of the cutters mast location. All in all generally the sloop is going to out sail the cutter. The concept of a cutter rig dates to differences in cloth and the reduction in weight of individual sails to aid in sail handling.
With a modern roller furling the need for a smaller head sail is greatly reduced, as the larger headsail with a longer leading edge improves windward ability. This given that the boat is also a modest 31 feet, the division of the sails versus the loss of windward ability seems a poor trade off to me. (All things being equal, and assuming that the mast height and position are different between the two).
If your concern is sailing on the bay, having a correctly designed roller furling sail of the correct size would make the boat sail safe and well on the bay. If your goal is farther afield where you may encounter gale force winds and steep seas, then I would recommend the addition of a solent stay for heavy weather work. This would eliminate the need for running backstays that are common in a cutter rig, would cost significantly less to install, and would keep the boat preforming better and be easier to sail, especially short handed.
Guy
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My opnion:
You could, I just looked up the specs for the two boats, the mast is in the same location same height, the only addition is the bow sprit, hardware and the forestay brought down to the stemhead.
However I would recommend leaving it as a sloop and installing a solent stay, (Provided that the boat is well balanced now) this will be cheaper, easier, and more functional for cruising than the cutter rig is going to be, especially short handed.
If you have to have the cutter because of the aesthetics, you can convert it to one by adding a bow sprit, while rerigging the boat. Since the rigging needs to be replaced on your boat anyway, it could be done at the same time. However it would add some significant cost to the project. Depending on your skill level the project may be within your abilities to do it yourself and save some money. Custom hardware for the bow sprit are likely to be your highest cost in adding it. A Gammon Iron, Bitts which include a mounting for the bow sprit, the bobstay fitting, and cranse iron will likely add up. When you add in the cost of a new pullpit, and a new roller furling unit, a staysail stay bracket, Running back tangs, running backstay pad eyes, running backstay tackle, stay sail track, stay sail track backing plates, New Life Lines, and all the other stuff that would be part of the project it is going to be an expensive, and time consuming project. Unless you are accustom to boat projects and the time and money expansion of such projects, I would not recommend it as a project.
Normally I would recommend tackling the rest of your project list first, getting some sailing time in on the bay, and then making rigging decisions like this. However having seen the boat myself, I would suggest that the prudent course is to evaluate this issue and replace the rigging as soon as possible. My recommendation would be to rerig the boat as is with the addition of a solent stay over the traditional forestay; you can have a heavy weather sail plan without the added expense and annoyance of running back stays. The 40 sq feet difference between the sloop and the cutter (8% or less of sail area) could easily be made up by bringing the jib a little closer to deck. New high quality sails would be higher on my list than 8% of sail area.
PM me your phone number and I would be happy to talk about your boat with you for a few minutes if you would like. I looked at that boat for a friend a while back and have the photos, although I can't find the notes that I took at the time.
Guy
You could, I just looked up the specs for the two boats, the mast is in the same location same height, the only addition is the bow sprit, hardware and the forestay brought down to the stemhead.
However I would recommend leaving it as a sloop and installing a solent stay, (Provided that the boat is well balanced now) this will be cheaper, easier, and more functional for cruising than the cutter rig is going to be, especially short handed.
If you have to have the cutter because of the aesthetics, you can convert it to one by adding a bow sprit, while rerigging the boat. Since the rigging needs to be replaced on your boat anyway, it could be done at the same time. However it would add some significant cost to the project. Depending on your skill level the project may be within your abilities to do it yourself and save some money. Custom hardware for the bow sprit are likely to be your highest cost in adding it. A Gammon Iron, Bitts which include a mounting for the bow sprit, the bobstay fitting, and cranse iron will likely add up. When you add in the cost of a new pullpit, and a new roller furling unit, a staysail stay bracket, Running back tangs, running backstay pad eyes, running backstay tackle, stay sail track, stay sail track backing plates, New Life Lines, and all the other stuff that would be part of the project it is going to be an expensive, and time consuming project. Unless you are accustom to boat projects and the time and money expansion of such projects, I would not recommend it as a project.
Normally I would recommend tackling the rest of your project list first, getting some sailing time in on the bay, and then making rigging decisions like this. However having seen the boat myself, I would suggest that the prudent course is to evaluate this issue and replace the rigging as soon as possible. My recommendation would be to rerig the boat as is with the addition of a solent stay over the traditional forestay; you can have a heavy weather sail plan without the added expense and annoyance of running back stays. The 40 sq feet difference between the sloop and the cutter (8% or less of sail area) could easily be made up by bringing the jib a little closer to deck. New high quality sails would be higher on my list than 8% of sail area.
PM me your phone number and I would be happy to talk about your boat with you for a few minutes if you would like. I looked at that boat for a friend a while back and have the photos, although I can't find the notes that I took at the time.
Guy
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larossa
Member II
Solent Stay with Sloop Rig
Tommy H,
I own an E31C and live in the Great Lakes Area. I am currently adding a solent stay to my boat. I had a sail built (about 100%, non overlapping)and will be adding the chain plate to the deck and tracks over the winter. I think the combination will be great and will open up many more sailing opportunities in heavy air sailing. I currently have a 150% headsail and main and we can go rail down in 18 knots of wind. After this I put a reef in and start taking a little on the roller furling jib. But you are pushing the limit of the sail cloth on the headsail. This was one of the primary reasons why the solent. With the bigger headsail than the a cutter rig, I like it much better in the light stuff. I can't tell you how it sails (solent)until maybe end of May, early June once I'm back in the water. I'm looking forward to it once I get a good blow. If you have any questions let me know.
Brian
E31C
Tommy H,
I own an E31C and live in the Great Lakes Area. I am currently adding a solent stay to my boat. I had a sail built (about 100%, non overlapping)and will be adding the chain plate to the deck and tracks over the winter. I think the combination will be great and will open up many more sailing opportunities in heavy air sailing. I currently have a 150% headsail and main and we can go rail down in 18 knots of wind. After this I put a reef in and start taking a little on the roller furling jib. But you are pushing the limit of the sail cloth on the headsail. This was one of the primary reasons why the solent. With the bigger headsail than the a cutter rig, I like it much better in the light stuff. I can't tell you how it sails (solent)until maybe end of May, early June once I'm back in the water. I'm looking forward to it once I get a good blow. If you have any questions let me know.
Brian
E31C