end boom mainsheeting and traveler location

[Geoff Nelson]

Has anyone moved the mainsheet on an E38 closer to the binnacle? I have a plan all worked out in my devious little head of a way to do it (and have it be temporary/easily changed back) but if someone has a better way, please let me know so I can save some time from the experimentation stage.

I hate the fact that I can't control the main from the helm and the crew can't see the main to adjust it properly from the companionway with the dodger up. The existing mid-boom sheeting seems to be a friction monster as well so does not work well in light air.

Any ideas?

Thanks,

Geoff

 

[Seth]

sheeting

Geoff,

You are right about the factory set up being a friction machine, and it would work much more smoothly AND be accessible from the helm with your intended set up.

It would also make the vang that much more important, and since you have the hydraulic unit I would consider keeping it. If you don't, you should get the solid Kicker or Garhauer unit-you will want to use it going upwind to even the loads on the boom and reduce the amount of sheet load required goin upwind. Reaching and running, of course, it will keep the leech working as you easae the sheet.
If you stay wth the hydraulics, consider adding a quick release valve on each side of the cockpit near the wheel-especially if the control panel is hard to reach when driving. This will allow you to "dump" the vang in a big puff when reaching with the sheet eased out. This will spill the top of the main sail and usually prevent a round up! Very cool. They are also known as "oh, sh...t valves".

I would love to see a drawing of your design when you can post it...

Good one!
Seth

 

[Geoff Nelson]

end boom sheeting

Seth,

The drawing is on the back of a bar napkin (where else!) and I don't do CAD so you'll have to wait for the full feature (I'll send pics when done if anyone is interested). It is a design I stole from a 5o5 (ironically to get away from end-boom sheeting and move to mid-boom sheeting!)

Goes something like this... ~4:1 (maybe 6 or7) from two blocks at the boom with a cleat at the lower one and beckett at the top. This lower is attached to a pair of 4:1's (one on each side leading out to either the track or a new attachment point near the primary winch) that act as the traveler. The traveler will be one-line leading back across the system that allows the leward side to be uncleted from the weather side. These ratios are going to be work in progress to see what works best.

I full intend to keep the hydro vang and the release is easy to get to (big spin nob at the top) so I am not too worred about that.

Thanks and any holes you can shoot in my plan would be appreciated (if you can envision it from my description).

Cheers,

G-

 

[Mindscape]

Friction Monster

Seth/others - any suggestions for reducing the friction in the factory mid boom set up? I don't think I'll go so far as moving to end boom sheeting (although I'd prefer it), so I'm wondering if there is anything that can be done to improve on the factory setup, without major modification.

 

[Geoff Nelson]

Battling the Friction Monster

The main thing you can do to make it less of a battle is replace the crappy Schaefer non-bearing'd blocks with some high-speed low-drag 75mm Harken Carbo Air Blocks. 2-3 times as expensive as the Schaefer but much nicer. Go to APS or sailingsupply.com.

The first things I did before spending money which helped a lot was 1) soak out the salt built up in all of them and then 2) silicon the bejesus out of them and 3) Make sure your main sheet itself is clean and free of salt build up. I noticed mine was REALLY stiff in places like where is had spend months loaded up on the winch or at a 90+ degree angle. I moved these spots around a bit, soaked the line for a few days in fabric softener and leached out the salt/grime and that helped as well.

 

[dwigle]

HARKen

I too was dissatisfied with the mainsheet and traveler on my E38. I changed the traveler to a Harken big boat and the mainsheet to Harken 57 high load single blocks and a 75 double to keep things in line. A teriffic difference, the boom goes out smoothly even in the lightest air, the traveler is light and easy.
Expensive, but I'd definitely recommend it. You could probably do it for a lot less with Garhauer and be just about as good.
The first thing to do though is check your blocks for frozen sheeves. I had two, one on the mainsheet and one jib car.

Don Wigle
Wiggle Room
E 38 #8
Pt. Richmond, CA

 

[Seth]

Mid boom/end boom

Hi guys,

I'll try and slay all of these dragons at once...
Geoff,

I'm with you-the only thing I am not seeing in my minds eye (cloudy though it may be) is the traveler-exactly where and how is it located/attached? Bear in mind it has been quite some time since I sat in a 38 cockpit.
As to your general arrangement-you will need AT LEAST 6:1 for the mainsheet, and even at that, you will likely want a fine tune set up, also 6:1 at least. The alternative to this is bringing the tail to one of the free winches;OK for distance sailing, but not so handy around the cans. No matter what, 4:1 without a winch won't come close to cutting it. We can go into this more if you like at a later time.

Don and 'scape: The original blocks CAN be helped as discussed with vigorous cleaning and lubing, but the ideal set up, as already discussed is upgrading the blocks for sure, and the traveller if possible as well. Harken is great, but I agree it is very hard to beat the value of Garhauer. Replace those blocks and you will see a world of difference. BUT....no matter what you do, get a high quality mainsheet!!! The new stuff from Maffioli does not kink (ever), does not stretch, runs freely through any block and is easy on the hands. For details, go to
Hall Spars & Rigging (Hall Spars on your browser), they have rigging packages for many boats, the Ben 36.7 will give a close idea of cost- Then you can call for a specific quote. It is not cheap, but an AMAZING difference!

The mainsheet is a definite shortcoming, and given these are tender boats whose "comfort" factor would be greatly enhanced with a well-functioning mainsheet system, you should take a hard look at this.

Sail on!
S

 

[Geoff Nelson]

Soft traveller

Seth,

The traveller is not car based... it is a "soft" system using a seperate 6 or 7:1 floating block+tackle setup to get the bottom block of the main sheet system to come up to weather. I was going to attach it to the outside T-Track just aft the primary winch. This is duplicated on each side with the leward one being lazy. The use of a continuous line from each side allows the new leward one to be uncleted from the new high side and take the boom up as you come back into point mode.

That make more sense? The only things I am worried about are 1) the angle of the main sheet will be real flat/hard to adjust/cleat/uncleat; and 2) the traveler system will have to take the same loads of the main sheet system as they will effectively be in-line. We will have to see... may try it out Sunday if I get my chores at home done in time!

 

[Seth]

yikes

To be honest, it worries me a bit. For one, the mainsheet block with the cleat and becket will not stand up correctly, and you are right, it will be very hard to cleat and uncleat properly.

I also wonder about what kind of line you can use that will be strong enough, yet not stretch. Under load (and what about the attachment point?), it will certainly be stretching, so your trim setting will change with every puff. While you could argue that this is good in big breeze, since when you get a puff, the traveler line will stretch up, reducing the sheet tension and freeing the leech, but this will also happen in med. air, when you want good tension that does not ease in puffs...

Unless I still have the idea wrong, I don't advise this for those reasons.
I like the idea of the end boom set up, but I think you either need a fixed traveler, or a fixed attachcment point for the sheet blocks and no traveler....


Keep those wheels turning, though!

S