Chainplate Inspection [Master Thread]

[dcoyle]

Hi Mark,

I was just down in Annapolis to tow back Etchells hull 1174 which I purchased with a few partners. The boat was next to Annapolis Yacht Club.

I love your 36! There is another here in Falmouth and he always beats me. Not very many of them around.



I spoke with Doug at Garhauer today about it and he was going to get back to me after looking at the pictures emailed to him. I have not heard from him yet but expect something in the next day or 2. Feel free to contact him at 909-985-7513 or I will let you know when he responds. The technique used to get mine out was to remove the nuts and lock washers the used a painters 5 tool (like a putty knife but stiffer) to scrape between underside of deck and aluminum backing plate then I used a cold chisel to gently pry on the backing block. That created a very small gap between the deck and block. I then tightened the nuts again to decompress the deck and get a bit of movement. Then used the 4 lb sledge to motivate the u bolts to move, 16 ounce hammer didn't work. Also put some penetrating oil in earlier in the week.

 

[markvone]

Doug,

Thanks for the removal tips! I will start on the removal ASAP so that I can determine what parts I need. It's a little complicated because the boat is in the water with the rig up. I'll have to get the halyards uncovered and set up to support the rig. I want to get the boat back together and sailing by the time it warms up which could be as early as March down here.

My last Ericson was E33RH, hull #3. It would be an excellent boat down here in the light air. That other E36RH up your way must be Fred Leighton's CADRE, it's one of the few E36RH's that I don't know what the hull number is. They made 32 between '81 and '84.

Mark

 

[dcoyle]

Hi Mark,

It is Cadre and Fred is a crafty race skipper, very hard to keep up with. Cadre was purchased by Fred in the same period as my E33 so both boats have been in the harbor since 1982!

Good luck with removal. I still have ports side to get at.

Doug at Garhauer asked me to ship a U bolt out to him so will let you know how this goes.

Doug

 

[markvone]

So Doug,

How do your U-bolts and backing blocks look? Are you planning to replace them regardless of condition?

I will start on removing one side of mine this week to inspect them. I'm thinking that replacement of the U-bolts and backing plates every 35 years is probably a good idea. I would love to replace the aluminum backing blocks with something other than aluminum that will last longer.

Thanks!

Mark

 

[dcoyle]

Hi Mark,

I have sent a U bolt and toggle to Garhauer which they received last Friday. I plan on replacing all the U bolts and backing plates and probable the toggles. Seems like smart move after 35 years.

Only have 1 side apart so far and the aft double one has some corrosion on deck side, the deck looks solid but plan in removing some of the core and filling with epoxy. Will start on port side once I can stop shoveling snow and recover a bit.

Doug

 

[dcoyle]

Success!!

Making progress on chain plate project thanks to help from this forum. All six U bolts have successfully been removed using heat gun, 4lb sledge and over tightening the bolts till deck slightly compressed to help break corrosion weld.

I took the aluminum backing plates to a local machine shop. He doesn't feel they need to be replaced just cleaned up. He is going to slightly enlarge the bolt holes to allow room for some type of sealant coating to help prevent corrosion in the future. I plan on either sealing with epoxy, paint or powder coating.

In order to remove the connecting rods I had to increase the size of one of the bolt holes from 3/4 to 1 inch and was able to unscrew both rods through that hole. Gauhauer Marine said they can increase the size of the new deck plate to completely cover it.

Thank you to all!!

Doug

 

[Frank Langer]

Hi Doug,

Now that you have removed the remaining U bolts, how do they all look? Is there as much corrosion on them as you anticipated? Although replacing them after 35 years is likely a good precaution, did they actually need replacing or would they have been ok for another 5 or 10 years? Did you need to actually have new ones manufactured by Garhauer or could the old ones have been installed, ie. were they in good enough condition to last longer?
Any thoughts on your experience here would be helpful.

Thanks,
Frank

 

[dcoyle]

Hi Frank,

I am not an engineer but the original U bolts still looked fine. The machine shop that is going to clean up the backing plates asked why I was going to replace them, he said the ones I showed him still looked usable.

My thought is I used a great deal of force with 4 lb sledge to get them to break free and not sure how much good that did to their health. Along with the new Gaurhuer U bolts have a better base plate than the original. If I was in a pinch I guess I would install the originals but it is a lot of work to go through just to rebed the original parts.

Doug

 

[Frank Langer]

Hi Doug,

Thanks for taking the time to reply. It's reassuring to know that your old ones were still in reasonable shape (for those of us who haven't replaced ours yet), but those new ones sure look nice. I agree absolutely that it makes sense to install new ones once you have gone to the work of removing the old ones. They look like they could last forever!

Frank

 

[markvone]

Hi Doug,

I would ask your machine shop about anodizing or some other coating (powder coat?) for the aluminum blocks instead of leaving them raw aluminum. You could even prime and paint them yourself if you are short of time. It doesn't look like they suffered much from contact with the stainless U bolts or the Navtec rod head. A protective coating would certainly have helped the top surface where collected moisture can sit on top of the block.

I haven't started to take mine apart yet. Since yours look OK, I may wait and do it over next winter since our sailing season is upon us and I'm still finishing other projects. I suspect my headliner will be un-stapled all season.

Mark

 

[e38 owner]

lessons learned on navtic rods

I had to do this same project on a SC40. The Sc40 has a balsa cored deck which added to the fun.
I did them and then redid them a couple years later. A few thing I learned along the way


Be careful when reinstalling the rods the tension is critical. Watch for bows or cups in the deck. As you tighten rig make sure the tension goes through to the Rod. They need to be tighter than I thought. Check a few weeks later.

Many of the Hobie owners have switched the backing plates to stainless. Some have had new ones machined from G10. I added a 1/4 inch g10 plate as reenforcment.

I coated the top of the rod and bolts with TefGel https://www.jamestowndistributors.c...word=tef_gel&gclid=CL6U7bfjutICFYS1wAod2SwPoQ then make sure there was caulking around the rod connection when reinstalling

Water is the enemy. Place a little counter sink in the top of the Gel coat on the deck so the caulk can surround the UBold.

With the bigger hole in the picture I would fill with with epoxy and redrill. Will keep any moisture out of the core.


I

 

[Christian Williams]

+1 TefGel https://www.jamestowndistributors.co...FYS1wAod2SwPoQ

 

[dcoyle]

Thanks for all the tips and advice.

I am having the machine shop enlarge the U bolt holes slightly but not the Navtec rod hole. My plan is to coat the aluminum with either powder coating or some type a paint I can do myself which is more likely. I also think I will skim coat the top of the backing plate with thickened West System to fill in the corrosion but I have to read about how it works with aluminum before committing to that. Once the aluminum is coated I will use Tef Gel to put a barrier between the stainless and aluminum, the slightly enlarged holes should leave room for a good coating.

As for the deck holes I plan on using the dremel tool to remove some of the solid plywood core then fill with thickened epoxy and redrilling so any future water wont get to the wood. The plywood is in great shape though no water damage in that area. I am planning on using vinyl butyl tape to rebed. I like the idea of a G10 plate between deck and aluminum. Thanks for the tip!

I spoke with a rigger about the rod tension, he said to tighten by hand and then another turn or two. I am a bit nervous about that piece of the projectit and will have the yard look at that when the mast gets stepped.

Doug

 

[dcoyle]

Problem

Went out yesterday to remove the port connecting rods and one of them is frozen to the pipe in the force grid. I used an 8 inch pipe wrench and cannot get any movement in either direction. My plan is to hit it with penetrating oil this week and try to get it to move again next week.

Someone recommended CRC Freeze Out, has any one used this before? I also have access to an induction heater which looks something like a soldering iron that could possibly be used to safely heat the rod without too much risk.

Doug

 

[aprslo]

Doug,

Thanks for the removal tips! I will start on the removal ASAP so that I can determine what parts I need. It's a little complicated because the boat is in the water with the rig up. I'll have to get the halyards uncovered and set up to support the rig. I want to get the boat back together and sailing by the time it warms up which could be as early as March down here.

My last Ericson was E33RH, hull #3. It would be an excellent boat down here in the light air. That other E36RH up your way must be Fred Leighton's CADRE, it's one of the few E36RH's that I don't know what the hull number is. They made 32 between '81 and '84.

Mark

I just bought E33RH hull #8 Secret Love, and my buddy bought hull #9 Fancy. We both need to remove and replace our chainplates. My rig is out and am having new standing rod rigging built. I am reading these strings on removal. I have the nuts off, but not the plates yet. I will try the above scrape and pry out. Once get those free, I think I need to unscrew the tie rods from the lugs down in the triaxial force grid stringer so I can lower the plate off the tie rod as I believe there is a mushroom end on the top of the tie rod. It looks like the best process to unscrew the tie rods is soak the lower threads in penetrant then use a pipe or Stillson wrench. When they go back in, make them tight, then 1 or 2 more turns. Doug at Gearhauer for new ubolts and waterproof the deck bedding. My plates are toast on the port side, ok on starboard, but plan to replace them all with G10 plates. Thoughts, suggestions, and advice are much appreciated, thank you.

 

[aprslo]

Success!!

Making progress on chain plate project thanks to help from this forum. All six U bolts have successfully been removed using heat gun, 4lb sledge and over tightening the bolts till deck slightly compressed to help break corrosion weld.

I took the aluminum backing plates to a local machine shop. He doesn't feel they need to be replaced just cleaned up. He is going to slightly enlarge the bolt holes to allow room for some type of sealant coating to help prevent corrosion in the future. I plan on either sealing with epoxy, paint or powder coating.

In order to remove the connecting rods I had to increase the size of one of the bolt holes from 3/4 to 1 inch and was able to unscrew both rods through that hole. Gauhauer Marine said they can increase the size of the new deck plate to completely cover it.

Thank you to all!!

Doug

E33 Chain Plate

Hi Guys,

I am into this project on my 82 E33. The chain plate design is very similar to the 34 with rods and aluminum backing plate. The U bolts which pass through the hull and bolt to the underside of the backing plate appear to be welded to the aluminum from corrosion. I am going to try to free the parts up but may end up cutting the U bolts above deck as you did. I am wondering where you sourced new U bolts and stainless steel backing plate?

Doug Coyle Cumberland Maine

Hi Doug, did you determine which angle your backing plates are? I have an 1982 E33 RH. I need to replace my backing blocks. They were corroded on top so couldn’t see the stamp for the angle. I’m guessing the 2 aft ones are on angle and the forward one is another. Thank you, Alex

 

[aprslo]

I used the wrong part name, I am wondering the angle of your U-Bolt Chainplate Tie-rod Blocks are? I have an 1982 E33 RH. I need to replace all 4. They were corroded on top so couldn’t see the stamp for the angle. Thank you, Alex

 

[Loren Beach]

Pardon me for preaching to the choir. But it is important: When you get into this project so far as to remove the original "tie rod blocks" and U bolts, PLEASE remove the old coring around each bolt. Over drill, epoxy fill, and redrill for every single one. I did that in 2021, and our coring was still dry, but all these bolts were inspected and re-bedded back in the 90's, the last time rig was down. Once you do that, those bolts should be sealed for another 30 years.

if you keep moisture from wicking down around those bolts you should never have the corrosion shown in some of the pix. If you look at my blog entry showing that area our aluminum blocks look quite clean with little surface corrosion. The original Navtec system that EY used was really really good, but too many previous owners fail to re-seal around all their deck penetrations over the decades. It's the old saw about "our of sight, out of mind".
Entropy is always present... and moisture/leaks/seaps is Entropy's evil accomplice on a sailboat.