Hove to Speed and Direction [and Reef Considerations]

[Vtonian]

Yesterday when practicing heaving to for the first time, with double reefed main and 80% of the #1 jib, in just 15-20kn I was still averaging 2kn with what seemed like very little side slip.

I assumed it would 'park' more (and drift more) and although probably most folks wouldn't care, in the often narrow waterways of Puget Sound, 2kn seems a little quick.

Should I expect to be able to learn to tune it to slower than 2kn or is that about expected for an E38 in 15-20kn?

FWIW, I think my reef points are at 15% and 32%, more common for offshore sailing, so my double reefed main looked pretty dang tiny to me and kept my speed mostly in the 4-5kn range all day, only once hitting 7kn on the reach home.

 

[Christian Williams]

Jib backed, mainsail luffing a little, wheel lashed to windward. Adjust mainsail setting as needed.

But I've never had any success heaving to with this boat, although Ryan Levinson, who sailed his 38 to the south seas, swore by it.

 

[Frank Langer]

Although boats are quite different in their manner of heaving to, I think speed is less important than how the boat is doing--ie. is it flat, comfortable for taking a short break, managing on its own without much attention, etc.
Frank

 

[Christian Williams]

I mentioned Ryan Levinson, once active here. Here's an update. He has a cat now, for necessary reasons. He mentions how an Ericson will toss you around offshore. How he is still able to kite sail is beyond me.

SAILING INTO CHANGE WITH RYAN LEVINSON​

SAILING INTO CHANGE Tackling Challenges One Kite Loop At A Time Story by Ryan Levinson When I wrote my last Waterlogs post four years ago, Nicole and I were just getting our sea legs after sailing over 10,000 nautical miles since leaving our homeport of San Diego. We explored Mexico before...

www.northsails.com

 

[Vtonian]

Mostly I did ok, only doing a couple accidental tacks, but that could be a problem in narrow water. I was trying to learn it because I got knocked down the other day and seemed like knowing how to take a little break to assess things would have been handy.

 

[Vtonian]

Jib backed, mainsail luffing a little, wheel lashed to windward. Adjust mainsail setting as needed.

But I've never had any success heaving to with this boat, although Ryan Levinson, who sailed his 38 to the south seas, swore by it.

'mainsail luffing a little'. I wondered about that, good tip, thanks. I think it was a little better when I trimmed the jib more too, maybe not catching as much wind as often through the swings. I was also experimenting with rudder angle, it seemed like about a half turn of the wheel was the most I could do without instigating accidental tacking. I'll have to try with more and less jib, see if that helps.

I'd read a fin keel should slip significantly compared to a long keel, which is why I thought maybe I'd trimmed it too much for sailing rather than parking, if I was still going 2kn and not slipping.

Dang thing just sails too well... What a fabulous problem.

 

[southofvictor]

Our 38 will crab along making 1kt or so and leaves a halfway decent slick. Like Christian suggested, I’ve found easing the main is key. It’s a balancing act between backed jib and rudder. Much main at all and we start moving ahead.

 

[Gaviate]

A great opportunity to review technique, of which, mine may need refinement!
I heave to by turning as if to tack without changing any sheets, then when my bow has swung 90 degrees (I watch the compass), and the headsail has filled with wind on the wrong side, I reverse the tiller hard over as if to turn back the other way and keep it there. Now I loose the main and then ignore it. Sometimes I will ease the headsail sheet to get a bigger "pillow" but never trim it in. Like magic, the world is a calmer place, and I can have my tea!
I don't have electronics on board so I've no idea about forward speed but with plenty of landmarks available where I sail, I'm not really going anywhere.
As Frank pointed out, I expect that my 27 acts quite differently than a 38 would.

 

[Vtonian]

Interesting. I'll test more with easing the main and not trimming the jib. My impression was that if I put the wheel back hard over, it'd go ahead and tack again, which I attributed to the forward momentum couldn't get rid of. I was really looking out for the wind to engage the backed jib and push the bow down but with anything more than a half turn of the wheel, it was just swinging on through. Take two...

Very fun though, in the sense of learning how the boat behaves in stronger winds and also the odd joy of being able to (almost) stop the boat, after so much effort trying to learn to trim for efficiency.

 

[Christian Williams]

I'll have to try this again, too. As I recall, Ryan said he furled the genoa such that no sailcloth was on the stay, to reduce chafe. In other words, something less than "J." Heaving to is very nice, and it sounds like our boats will do it with a little experimentation.

 

[Vtonian]

Yes, and although most folks probably wouldn't bother while beating up a quarter mile wide channel, those of us of a certain age will know that sometimes you just gotta take a break.

 

[Gaviate]

to reduce chafe. In other words, something less than "J."

This is a good idea. My smallest headsail is a 135 genoa and she does quite alot of dragging around things sometimes. I also have hanks so no chance to reduce sail other than one reef point which I would probly never use just for heaving to.
I was also thinking that perhaps you may need to start bleeding speed before the turn. My 27 seems to stop on a dime, I think owing to the underwater profile of the (3/4) keel. Those fin keels may be a little more slippery? I've never sailed a fin keel boat so just guessing here, but you're right...great fun!!

 

[Roger Janeway]

. . . furled the genoa such that no sailcloth was on the stay, to reduce chafe . . .

I do this on my E26 simply because the boat heaves to better; better balance between the opposing forces, it seems. Less chafe is an extra benefit.

 

[G Kiba]

This is a good idea. My smallest headsail is a 135 genoa and she does quite alot of dragging around things sometimes. I also have hanks so no chance to reduce sail other than one reef point which I would probly never use just for heaving to.
I was also thinking that perhaps you may need to start bleeding speed before the turn. My 27 seems to stop on a dime, I think owing to the underwater profile of the (3/4) keel. Those fin keels may be a little more slippery? I've never sailed a fin keel boat so just guessing here, but you're right...great fun!!

Heaving to with a larger head sail is a challenge! I am so use to doing it with the #3 (90%) trimmed in tight. Both the Olson and prior E27 heaved to nicely. The Olson wants to sail out of it if you don't kill off the speed. I recall it working only if I put the helm hard over under 1.0 knot or so.

 

[Vtonian]

whelp, next sailing day is tomorrow, so i should be able to test all this out. fwiw, here's last time

 

[Christian Williams]

We should discuss the lead of the reefing line. It needs to attach to the boom first, then up through the cringle, then back to the sheave.

The reef line starts with a (small) bowline with the line led through it, so that when tightened the loop cinches the boom.

When winched in, the reef line then pulls the clew down to the boom as well as aft.


Kenyon booms came with cars on tracks for such connections. They work, but the loop is elegant and simple. The loop works with loose-footed mainsails, and also with slugged foots. In the latter case, Moderator Guy Stevens says, the correct position of the loop needs to be found by observation, as the loop cannot position itself as it does on a loose-footed sail.

 

[bigd14]

Kenyon booms came with cars on tracks for such connections.

I have these on my boom but they are unused. I have a new loose footed main in hand to replace the current slugged one (but can’t install it yet due to a shoulder injury). Would these tracks interfere with the reef line loops sliding with the loose foot main? Is it advisable to remove them first assuming stainless/aluminum corrosion is not too bad?

 

[Christian Williams]

I left my tracks on. No issue at all.

 

[Dave G.]

I left my tracks on. No issue at all

Same here.

 

[Dave G.]

I have a new loose footed main in hand to replace the current slugged one

Curious, How is your clew going to be attached to the boom ? Strap ?