Poor man's anchor winch?

[gargrag]

Hi crew,

we have an ericson 25+
With my wife and my 5y/o son, we've gotten into the habit of anchoring for lunch and then heading back to our marina. I'd like to add some sort of windlass or winch, to make pulling the anchor an easier job for wifey. But I'm not looking forward to investing thousands of dollars on the setup. I wonder if someone has come up with some cheaper alternatives for the job? I saw some people using car winches.

Thanks in advance

 

[Loren Beach]

If you must, the least expensive option might be a used two speed ST winch mounted on the foredeck. Use a ten inch handle, or a 12 inch if you can source one.

Before going further down this anchoring rabbit hole, how about the much much simpler scheme where, like many other sailors, "wifey" drives and you go forward and set and retrieve the anchor. We have done this for many years/decades on our prior 26 footer, and now on the larger boat.

We communicate with "standard crane signals" (sort of) where I point up for a little more throttle, point down for less, and hold up a fist for putting it in neutral. I point port or starboard to pass along steering directions to keep me lined up with the anchor line.

I do not know what your budget is, but there are several types of vhf headsets (hands free) that many boaters, sail and power, swear by.
Article I found: https://www.passagemaker.com/technical/the-marriage-saver

Edit: just checked the 25+ displacement and it is about 5K. Our former Niagara 26 displaced 4K. Our anchor setup was a Danforth 8, about ten feet of chain, and 150' of line. The chain & rode was stored in a mesh "anchor bag" with a handle, stored under a seat hatch aft. Not totally convenient, but quite workable. Present 34 footer has the whole anchoring ensemble in the anchor locker.

 

[Christian Williams]

I don't know how deep your typical anchorage is, or holding ground, but I used to carry a "lunch hook" -- a small Danforth with line but no chain. It worked for swimming or lunch (only) , and was easy to deploy and retrieve.

There isn't a substitute for a windlass, unfortunately. But I hope to be corrected.

 

[bgary]

Maybe it's just me, but about the only time I wish I had a windless is when breaking the anchor loose off the bottom.

On those (rare) occasions when pulling the boat up and shortening the rode to vertical requires some help, I've run the rode through a snatch block on the midships rail and led it back to one of the cockpit primary winches. So far, has done the trick, and once the anchor is off the bottom it has been easy enough to bring it on board at the bow as normal.

$.02

 

[Frank Langer]

When hauling anchor my wife is at the helm, motoring slowly in forward gear as I haul in the anchor rode. When I'm above the anchor I wrap the rode around a bow cleat while continuing very slow forward until I feel the anchor rode slack a bit, indicating that the anchor has broken free. My wife then puts the gear in neutral while I haul the remaining line and chain and secure the anchor at the bow. My wife will engage forward gear slowly to avoid any reefs, rocks or other dangers.
This approach has worked well in depths up to 50 feet with a 22 lb. anchor, 25 feet of chain and up to 240 feet of rope on our E30+.
The only time this is a challenge is when we anchor in really sticky mud, with a clump of heavy mud stuck to the anchor as I raise it. (I'm almost 73 years old, slight build).
My wife has suggested we get a windlass, but that would require structural strengthening on deck at the bow, which I don't really want to undertake.
Frank

 

[Bolo]

Gargrag, You want to save $$$ for a cheap windlass which I totally understand especially since you’re just dropping the hook for lunch. By far the best solution is Christian’s, getting a Danforth with rope only rode that’s easy to deploy and retrieve using the best windlass you have abroad right now. You. As mentioned by others here, a few worked out hand signals between the “anchor man” at the bow and ”helms-person” to motor up to a point over the anchor and then allow the swells or the motor in the boat (after you tie off the rode to a cleat) to break the anchor free which is the very cheapest solution. If you’re anchoring during what will be a calm almost windless night a Danforth and rope rode will work also.

Beyond that the only solution is a proper windlass. I know all about this because I looked for a ground tackle solution for a couple of years and found a good one for my needs. I had a rope/chain rode on my E32-3 which was OK for anchoring until it was time to leave. Again, my first mate would motor up towards the anchor steering by way of hand signals from me at the bow while I pulled up the rope while dropping it into the anchor well. But when it came to the chain things got a bit harder. At that point I had to sit on the foredeck with one leg in the anchor well and the other braced against the forward part of the the opening. To add to it all, most of the anchorages on the Chesapeake Bay have a heavy, sticky mud bottom which can be great for holding but not so great when pulling the chain and anchor up. Luckily a previous owner of my boat installed a wash down pump with a hose in the anchor locker. So it was pull, wash, pull, wash….and so on until I reached the anchor where I had to hang off the pulpit to wash the heavy black mud off. I’m now in my 70s and this gets old so I looked for an easier, economical windlass solution.

I won’t go into what I found, there is plenty of information here on this web site and on others. Needless to say I didn’t want to spend lots of $$$ on a windlass “system“ that was a challenge to install on my E32-3 requiring major alterations to the anchor locker. I also anchor only about 6 to 8 times a season at the most so the considerable investment in time and money didn’t seem worth it. So I found a compromise that would work. A Lofrans Horizontal Manual Windlass. https://defender.com/en_us/lofrans-royal-horizontal-manual-windlass

I bought mine from a local shop (Bacon Sails in Annapolis) for about $1,400 and installed it myself with very little trouble. No batteries, cables, switches, etc. and it’s almost bullet proof. Very reliable. You’re the motor but now you have a lever and gear advantage. I had to but a new rope/chain rode which has more chain than my old rode and it fits the chain wheel. I still motor up to the chain but now I’m standing not sitting in the anchor well and when I start pulling the chain in with the Lofrans I’m cranking and washing simultaneously. The Lofrans always breaks the anchor free with very little effort on my part and pulling in the 40 feet of chain, although slower than an electric windlass, gets the job done easily IMO.

Here a link to the blog on this site I did covering the install and operation. https://ericsonyachts.org/ie/ubs/installing-a-manual-windlass-on-a-e32-3.982/

Here is also a link to one of the anchorages we visit on the bay where I talk about the windlass and pull up the anchor. If you don’t want to see all of the video go to time stamp 7:26 for the windlass spot. Good luck!

 

[gabriel]

small Danforth is a excellent idea. If I can add to that: one can make it even lighter by using an aluminum danforth (fortress). I own a smaller one and it's stupid light and easy to handle. Not hard to find secondhand online, especially the smaller ones.

 

[Vtonian]

My wife has suggested we get a windlass, but that would require structural strengthening on deck at the bow, which I don't really want to undertake.
Frank

FWIW Frank, the PO of my boat 'reinforced' the deck for the windlass with a cutting board. No shimming, fairing, bracing, just slapped up under the deck between the windlass above and the motor below.


Horrible, but since the windlass is just for lifting the anchor, not freeing it or holding the boat at anchor, it seems to have survived, so although on my list of things to fix, it's nowhere near the top. If I was cruising oceans and running for any port in storms, it would be...

 

[Christian Williams]

Yikes. I can't visualize the location, or where the chain drops to. Any pix with a wider view of the location?

I have seen casual installs, but that one is right up there for first prize. And who needs nuts and washers....

 

[G Kiba]

I have been thinking about this manual windless for sometime now but realize that i currently don't anchor very often. When I first considered buying, it was $800. That was several years ago. Now its about 1,200

Muir Windlass MVM500-3/8 | Fisheries Supply

Save More on Your Muir Windlass #MVM500-3/8 MUI MVM500-3/8 EASYWEIGH 500 MANUAL LOWPRO 3/8HT, R/C at Fisheries Supply. Excellent Customer Service, Ready to Ship. Marine Supplies Since 1928!

www.fisheriessupply.com

 

[Todd charchenko]

Maybe it's just me, but about the only time I wish I had a windless is when breaking the anchor loose off the bottom.

On those (rare) occasions when pulling the boat up and shortening the rode to vertical requires some help, I've run the rode through a snatch block on the midships rail and led it back to one of the cockpit primary winches. So far, has done the trick, and once the anchor is off the bottom it has been easy enough to bring it on board at the bow as normal.

$.02

Have done the same on our 29 and will and will be adding a 1/2” line with a chain hook on one end for when we get into the anchor chain as the first time I needed the winch assistance we were hung up in a kelp bed and brought up about 30lbs of sea floor with our 45lb anchor

 

[Christian Williams]

Here's a new one on me--a no-windlass technique for anchoring in 400 feet of water.

Not suitable for us, probably, but clever.

 

[Nick J]

FWIW Frank, the PO of my boat 'reinforced' the deck for the windlass with a cutting board. No shimming, fairing, bracing, just slapped up under the deck between the windlass above and the motor below.

View attachment 50321
Horrible, but since the windlass is just for lifting the anchor, not freeing it or holding the boat at anchor, it seems to have survived, so although on my list of things to fix, it's nowhere near the top. If I was cruising oceans and running for any port in storms, it would be...

Wow, you're not alone with a less than perfect v birth. One of the main reasons our boat was reduced was the anchor locker leak had never been addressed and the bulkhead was damaged. The previous owner installed a Lewmar 12V/700-Watt Pro-Series windlass. They had a bracket fabricated to bold to the main bulkhead and the bottom of the anchor locker pan. If it wasn't for the main bulkhead being rotten, it would be a great install. When I finally replace the main bulkhead, I'm going to reuse the same setup.

It may be small for a 25+, but the Lewmar Pro series seems to be a good low cost option that meets the needs for most casual cruisers and it fits well in the anchor pan.

Here's the damaged bulkhead and the bolts and washers holding the windlass bracket. I deconstructed the vee birth shortly after we purchased the boat, now I just need to find the time to do the hard work.



Windlass:


Bracket:

 

[peaman]

I have been thinking about this manual windless for sometime now but realize that i currently don't anchor very often. When I first considered buying, it was $800. That was several years ago. Now its about 1,200

Muir Windlass MVM500-3/8 | Fisheries Supply

Save More on Your Muir Windlass #MVM500-3/8 MUI MVM500-3/8 EASYWEIGH 500 MANUAL LOWPRO 3/8HT, R/C at Fisheries Supply. Excellent Customer Service, Ready to Ship. Marine Supplies Since 1928!

www.fisheriessupply.com

I have also admired that unit for a while. I like that it is open, so you can haul line ride in manually, and then when more pull is needed, drop the rode on the windlass and grind away. When finished, take the rode off and drop into the chain locker. I saw one at Newport boat show a couple years ago. Was told that it is suitable for chain only. Would love to hear from actual users.

 

[Alan Gomes]

Maybe it's just me, but about the only time I wish I had a windless is when breaking the anchor loose off the bottom.

On those (rare) occasions when pulling the boat up and shortening the rode to vertical requires some help, I've run the rode through a snatch block on the midships rail and led it back to one of the cockpit primary winches. So far, has done the trick, and once the anchor is off the bottom it has been easy enough to bring it on board at the bow as normal.

$.02

It's best not to use a windlass for breaking out the anchor. It's purpose is for lifting the anchor and rode. Depending on the particular windlass and the anchor/rode involved you may get away with it, but it's not advisable technique and could damage/shorten the life of the windlass.

A better method for breaking out the anchor is just to snub it up short, cleat it off, and go back to the cockpit and have a beer. The rocking of the boat will break it out. Then, use the windlass to heave up the anchor and all the weight associated with it and the rode.

In answer to the original post: I have essentially the same boat (an Ericson 26-2). I thought about adding a windlass because I have anchored in some pretty deep anchorages at Catalina (100' or even more at the Isthmus) and lifting my 10kg Rocna and chain is a bit of a workout for my 69 yr. old self. But for the amount of times I anchor and all the complications involved I decided against it. If you are in relatively shallow areas and just want to anchor for lunch the advice about a light-weight lunch hook is good. Depending on the bottom conditions take a look at a Fortress, which could be good for what you have in mind.

 

[Nick J]

I have also admired that unit for a while. I like that it is open, so you can haul line ride in manually, and then when more pull is needed, drop the rode on the windlass and grind away. When finished, take the rode off and drop into the chain locker. I saw one at Newport boat show a couple years ago. Was told that it is suitable for chain only. Would love to hear from actual users.

This looks like a really promising unit especially for a smaller boat like the 25+ where it's difficult to find space. Great find!

 

[Vtonian]

Yikes. I can't visualize the location, or where the chain drops to. Any pix with a wider view of the location?

I have seen casual installs, but that one is right up there for first prize. And who needs nuts and washers....

Yay, another first place trophy for my boat! I'm going to have to convert the shower to a trophy case.
Here's where it is and where the chain goes:


Note the minimalist U bolt the rode is terminated with. I suppose that's so the last thing that happens if you get to the end of your rode is the boat isn't dragged under by the anchor, the U bolt instead breaks free so you can crash onto the rocks like a civilized person.
Also, the super handy safety feature of storing a flashlight right down there in the chain locker, one of about 8 flashlights tucked into various crannies aboard.

Of course, this arrangement makes cuddling in the V berth awkward but some sacrifices must be made...?
I suppose I will lose some points on the issue of washers.

However, I think I can reclaim them with the snazzy solution for dragging chain across the deck.

And yes, there is also another anchor and rode in the stock chain locker, it's just really a pain to get into, although I suppose if your main rode has been carried away after the U bolt snapped, it'd be much easier.
The windlass also has a handy remote, you just open a porthole and tuck it through, and it all runs off its own lithium battery, which is charged via a converter that plugs into an AC outlet that's wired to the main converter to run off the battery banks that are charged by the solar panels on the bimini that keep me from seeing the sail trim from the helm.

Rube Goldberg himself could not have done a finer job.
That said, I think of my boat as a warehouse of really nice parts that just need to be (re)installed, with the added bonus that I get to sail it. Does anyone else love their boat so much they can't come aboard without giving the mast a big hug? I'm not embarrassed to say, I do.

 

[peaman]

I’m guessing that the chain locker is now used for storing life jackets?

 

[Christian Williams]

Many innovations required to add a windlass to an Ericson. Thanks for the photos, it makes everything clear.

You know, regarding the end of the anchor rode, I was always taught it is not to be secured. My current boat has a little u-bolt inside the anchor pan, in case leaving it lying there unattached seems crazy-making. The U-bolt will withstand 9.3 pounds of force before tearing through the pan. But sure, I tie it off anyhow. For neatness.

I think the reason for the tradition comes from ships, where a runaway windlass sends 100 tons of chain flailing and smoking and you don't really want to the rest of the ship to follow it down to the bottom.

 

[Vtonian]

That makes sense and I was warned about letting it freespool so I guess I'm going to lose one Rube point for that...