1971 E27 purchase questions

[SCLo]

New to the site, very close to purchasing a 1971 E27 but have just a few questions for now. There was about a quart or so of water in the bilge, there's no automatic bilge pump (though the manual one does work). Is this troubling? The owner seems to think it's always there and that it rarely changes in volume. What's the most likely cause of this in the bilge?

The head doesn't have a holding tank. He thinks it never had one, that the early E27s simply pumped overboard--- which this one will do. Does anyone have experience with this year and can give me some idea of how it came originally and/or whether it will be incredibly expensive/difficult to add a tank or flexible bladder?

Thank you all in advance!

 

[Glyn Judson]

Holding tank installation made easy.

Dear friend, To the best of my recollection other boats your size were fitted with a Ronco Plastics http://www.ronco-plastics.com/newRonco/search.php?search=13&search2=Submit B262, 13 gallon tank. As you can see, they are still in business and can make a tank for in jiffy time. As to plumbing your system, it's pretty ease and a great guide is a slight departure from the West Marine Advisor's "Our Favorite Method" as can be in the head section of any West Marine Catalog. Save yourself the expense and unnecessary installation of a Y-valve and instead install a 1 1/2" plastic Tee in its place.

Become a religious user of Odorlos head treatment (very affordable at West Marine) and you'll NEVER have even the slightest trace of head odor for as long as you own the boat, if about once a year you flush the system from the bowl all the way into the holding tank using straight vinegar or a 50/50 mix of muriatic acid and water. You really don't have to use the very expensive odor barrier hose either as long as you use nature friendly Odorlos. After each annual system flushing, be sure to totally rid the system of any traces of vinegar or acid prior to using the Odorlos, otherwise it won't work. DON'T USE A BLADDER, they can chafe on the hull over time and leak creating a problem nobody wants to have to deal with. Go for it, Glyn Judson, E31 hull #55, Marina del Rey CA

 

[dt222]

As far as the water in the bilge- it could be coming from one of several sources:

• Leaking ports (windows)
• Leaking through hulls
• If original A4 engine with stuffing box- dripping packing gland
• Leaking cooling/exhaust hose

I would pump it dry, and then try and determine the source- all of them can be managed in one way or another.

Good luck.

 

[Bill Kitchens]

Replacing head in e27

New to the site, very close to purchasing a 1971 E27 but have just a few questions for now. There was about a quart or so of water in the bilge, there's no automatic bilge pump (though the manual one does work). Is this troubling? The owner seems to think it's always there and that it rarely changes in volume. What's the most likely cause of this in the bilge?

The head doesn't have a holding tank. He thinks it never had one, that the early E27s simply pumped overboard--- which this one will do. Does anyone have experience with this year and can give me some idea of how it came originally and/or whether it will be incredibly expensive/difficult to add a tank or flexible bladder?

Thank you all in advance!

I replace mine with a West Marine Portable, which has a small holding tank. It has a conversion kit to make permanent with a pump out.

 

[Jeff Asbury]

New to the site, very close to purchasing a 1971 E27 but have just a few questions for now. There was about a quart or so of water in the bilge, there's no automatic bilge pump (though the manual one does work). Is this troubling? The owner seems to think it's always there and that it rarely changes in volume. What's the most likely cause of this in the bilge?

The head doesn't have a holding tank. He thinks it never had one, that the early E27s simply pumped overboard--- which this one will do. Does anyone have experience with this year and can give me some idea of how it came originally and/or whether it will be incredibly expensive/difficult to add a tank or flexible bladder?

Thank you all in advance!

I always have a little water in the bilge on my E-27. Pretty much to be expected. Can trickle down from condensation, the stuffing box or minor leaks from around deck fittings. But yes, I would install both a automatic and manual bilge pumps.

I as well did not have a holding tank when I purchased my 1973 E-27 12 years ago. I added a 12 gallon holding tank as well as a "Y" Valve and a macerator pump so I have the ability to pump the waste out from a deck fitting at at pump out station as well as legally pump it out when I am 3 miles off shore. The "Y" Valve allows you to switch from pumping it out through the hull or out into a pump out station. I also replaced the original aging head and all the related plumbing. Total cost was around $1,200. Most of that was labor. Yes I paid a marine mechanic. A holding tank is required here in California.

Attaching a little diagram of how I set up my automatic bilge pump for the deep sump bilge on my E-27.

 

[G Kiba]

Don't forget about the ice box!. My 73' drains directly to the bilge. Between leaks, packing glands, and function, the 27 bilge can be a pretty deep damp place.
As far as the head, if you plan to day sail with the occasional weekend, a prota-potty is an inexpensive and simple alternative to doing all that plumbing and maintenance. Buy a good one (electric) and you will still save money, time, and the agony of having to pump out. I purchased the tank, hoses, and related hardware ($$$) and backed out prior to drilling holes for the pump out and vent. Sold everything at a consignment shop and been happy since. I'm one who enjoys sailing the boat - not working on it! That is unless it's to make it more fun to sail! That's a different story.

 

[G Kiba]

Great diagram Jeff (bilge solution). I have yet to do this! Maybe this winter.
I plan to haul this October to do the bottom and to have the head through hulls removed. Also plan on replacing the sink's through hull with plastic.

 

[Gary Holford]

Grey and black water

Nice artwork Jeff. I'll add that my auto bilge system came wired with a 3-way switch, auto-off-manual. SCLo, regarding bilge water if the boat has an A-4 you should check how many drips/minute the packing gland is letting thru. If nothing is coming thru it should be adjusted. I changed mine (in the water, don't attempt without good pump and stiff drink) when it was letting thru 120 drips a minute. Now it's about six/min which is manageable. Good idea to put some oil absorb sheets under engine (if so equiped). Keeps bilge cleaner and better for environment.

If you decide to install a holding tank it isn't rocket science though a background in yoga is very useful. I changed my tank this year as the old one was creased and of unknown vintage. Think it was under $200 delivered (Todd 13 gal). Mounting involves wood blocks and strapping. Cutting hole in deck for pump out fitting ($40) a little tricky, and don't forget the vent hole ($30) in upper hull. Proper sanitation hose (vacuum) will cost you maybe $3/ft depending on source and brand plus plastic fittings, vent hose, some hose valves and clamps ($100).

As to going to all this trouble (as opposed to a low capacity pottapotti) I assume your present head is still serviceable and really clean. In my mind you have to consider how long your missions are going to be and the sex of your crew. Enough send. Good Luck

 

[dthriftusa]

bilge pump and replacing head in E27

Jeff, I too like your illustration. I am also restoring an E27, 1978 and was noodeling a better way to upgrade the bilge pump. I like your lifting stick and will boldly copy your idea. Thanks for sharing. The bottom of my bilge was nasty,

My E27, purchased a year or so back also had a direct overboard head discharge. After much consideration I installed a Porti-Potty instead of adding a holding tank plus stuff. I did add an extension block to properly attach the front hold down clamp to make it fit properly.

I replaced the heat riser water muffler. It looks like the diagram for the E29 unit found on this forum, but is smaller. I plan to show the appropriate dimension in a later post. Mine was completely stopped up and did not allow enough water to pass through resulting in excessing overheating of the engine.

Gary, you will enjoy your E27. They sail nicely, but these older boats have a lot of water leak sources especially if the maintenance was neglected by previous owners.

Doug Thrift