86 E32-3 Bilge System, What drains where?

[newgringo]

Hello,
I am busy working to get this newly acquired E32-3 into shape and the bilge system is confounding me for sure. I think I understand the mast/shower drain bilge. But the 4 sections forward of that just don't seem to drain correctly. Starting at the engine sump, I dump a gallon or 2 of water in which slowly seems to appear in the sump under the ladder (sump#1) only to dissapear into some 1/2 inch dia holes that go who knows where. Eventually some water starts to come out of the 1 inch dia hole from the engine sump and drains into sump#1 and exit forward thru another 1 inch dia hole but does not drain into the next sump forward (sump#2). It's going out of sump#1 but not coming out into sump#2. Humm. And there is lots of black hard "stuff'" in the area between sumps#1 and 2. Now if I dump water in sump#2 it will drain into sump#3, which has the pickup for the Whale manual bilge pump. And sump#3 will drain into sump#4, which has a float switch and electric bilge pump. Sump#5 here is the mast/shower sump which works as designed.
So my questions are numerous:
1. Is there a seperate sump for the engine compartment which should be pumped?
2. How is a serious engine compartment leak handled?
3. Should sump#1 drain freely into sumps forward of that to the bilge pumps?
4. Now the biggee - If the engine sump and all 5 sumps forward of that are dry, is the boat really dry?
This is a beautiful boat and I am looking forward to lots of sailing. But I do like things to work correctly, starting with the bilges. Now as for propellers etc, we are still working that problem.
Thanks to all - Jerry Riggs, Kingston, WA (close to PWT)

 

[Morgan Stinemetz]

Hi,
I cannot help you with the engineering on the sumps and bilge pumps, but vinegar will get rid of that black buildup. It's calcium, I think, and vinegar cuts it. I used to have the problem with the head on my E-27. But then I started wearing Depends and it went away.
Morgan Stinemetz

 

[NateHanson]

Hehe!

Jerry, congrats on the new boat. I'm envious!

If the engine compartment is truely dry when you're in the water, make sure the stuffing box isn't too tight? Or perhaps you've been blessed with a PYI dripless gland? Just make sure you don't fry up the shaft when you run the engine.

Certainly something you've thought of, but thought I'd mention it anyways, just in case.

 

[Geoff Johnson]

On our model (32-3) the engine sump is a pan under the engine that should not drain anywhere. Any engine fluids that end up there have to be removed by a hand pump and absorbent towels. The area aft of the engine sump is connected by a pipe to the bilge so that any water from the stuffing box goes through the engine sump and ends up in the bilge. Finally there is a sump in front of the mast that is accessible only by means of the 1" hole under the teak trim in front of the mast and maybe through a hole cut under the port settee. This will always have water and should be hand pumped every once in a while. Finally, I think you find it impossible to keep the bilge dry because of water coming down the inside of the mast. (On my boat a week of rain will fill the bilge.) Unless you channel the mast water into the bilge, it tends to run out onto the sole and cause rot. I built a silicone moat around the mast base with a channel to a small cutout in the bilge cover. Because it is impossible to keep water out of the bilge, I have encased the keel bolts with PVC pipe (with screw tops for inspection).

 

[Mindscape]

Bilge

Congrats on your boat!! - you are going to love it. My experience is the same as Geoff's. I also have have to empty the bilge after a good rain, just as Geoff described. You might want to search on for Geoff's thread on cabin sole replacement. There are some pictures of some of the bilges with the cabin sole removed. At this point Geoff has to be the definitive source for info on the cabin sole and what's under it on 32-3's.
This water in the bilge bugged me for a while, but sailing the boat is so much fun I got over it

 

[Geoff Johnson]

Yes, I'm the "sole man".

 

[gross]

I am a fairly new owner of a 1985 32-3 #623. I saw Geoff's pictures of the sole replacement this morning and was surprised at the hidden bilge.

I have some discoloration in the floor in this area so think I might have water. I read one of the posts talking about having to manually drain this sump. How is that done. I'll have to look for the access hole that was mentioned.

I have an issue that might be related. Two of my bilge plates are rotting and have been stepped through because the side rails came off so there was no support. Has anyone else had this problem and replaced them and what worked the best? Currently it's the shower sump and the cover just aft of that one.

This discussion post is great - a lot of knowledge in here and I really appreciate being able to tap in.

Thanks,
Greg

 

[Geoff Johnson]

32-3 Drains

I pump it out with a 3 dollar squeeze bulb pump that has a long stem to reach down into the recess through the access hole in front of the mast.



BTW, it's been a few years since I've visited this forum. In the interim, the boat was damaged in a storm, repaired and Awlgripped and rebedded the keel for a second time, this time with heavy duty SS plates on the bottom of the bilge. However, I've developed a strong preference for sea kayaking over sailing, so the boat doesn't see much use. At least with a sea kayak you get some exercise and don't have to worry about fixing things all the time.

 

[Mindscape]

Welcome back!

Geoff - good to see you back. I can understand your positoin on kayaking vs. sailing after some of the things you and your boat have been thru. I remember the pics of your boat in the storm off your marina. Hope you continue to contribue, you have a wealth of knowledge on the 32-3.

I do the same thing as Geoff when pumping the 'hidden' bilge, I use a cheap hand pump to remove any water that accumulates there.

 

[gross]

Thanks for the replies guys. Wondering, because I'm still amazed that there is a "hidden bilge", how often do you pump (suck) it out. I'm thinking that if it has been awhile - a long while - since it's been pumped out, that could be why my floor up there is dark. Every time I sail the boat, and it heels, water is soaking the underside of the flooring??

Does the bilge plate issue ring a bell with anyone - and has anyone had to replace them?

Thanks...Greg

 

[Bolo]

Hidden bilge photos

Can someone direct me to these sole replacement photos showing the hidden bilge? BTW Gross, on our E32-3 (1987) we have a small sump pump that empties the mast/shower bilge and pumps it out the stern someplace. Only problem was that the water kept draining back and cycling the pump over and over. So I installed a one-way valve right after the pump. I figure that since it's just the mast bilge it wont be a problem. No one way on the main electric or manual bilge pump. I'm now in the process of chasing down all the rain leaks that make it to the main bilge. Closed up a lot of them when I caulked the bright work on the transom. Water was getting in through some of the railing connections and pass the edge of the wood. Still have more to chase down but getting close to finding all of them.

BTW, DO NOT use Bristol finish on the transom wood. It bubbles up and flakes off if ANY water gets under the wood and tries to get out. I have to take all the Bristol off and then refinish with the new Natural Cetol finish.

 

[Loren Beach]

Sounds like good progress! I have not tried Bristol Finish. Actually, the quart can of "Cetol Light" that I have is turning out to be a lifetime supply. (It goes on very thin.)

As to leaks at the transom, do not forget my experiences of having a persistent decade-plus small leak from "somewhere aft" go away completely after I replaced the old cracked plastic above-water thru hulls across the whole stern.

Loren