I am the proud new owner of a 1975 E29 with very limited knowledge of engines. My boat has a FWC - runs steady at 180 degrees - 5.5 knots at 1400 rpm and 6.5 at 2000 which appear to be acceptable. She has quick cold starts and idles comfortably. I have installed a proper shore power system and smart battery charger that appears to work well - I have found this forum to be extremely helpful. I am considering changing the current point/plug/condensor setup fro an Indigo Electronic ignition kit - does anyone have any comments both pro or con to this idea. Cheers
A4 Electronic ignition conversion
- Thread starter Pendrag0n
- Start date
tenders
Innocent Bystander
Once you go electronic, you'll never go back to points. The concern about sudden failure of electronic ignition is minimal to begin with, but can be completely mitigated by keeping your old points in a sealed back onboard or having an extra $100 electronic ignition module on hand.
Electronic ignitions almost never fail, but when they do it's usually due to owners fooling around with them at the dock, not underway.
Make sure you look at moyermarine.com for both parts and the exhaustive advice available on the forums.
Electronic ignitions almost never fail, but when they do it's usually due to owners fooling around with them at the dock, not underway.
Make sure you look at moyermarine.com for both parts and the exhaustive advice available on the forums.
I gotta play devil's advocate here - I have many vintage cars I could convert to electronic ignition, but don't - eak one of them has 2 distributors with 2 sets of points in each for a total of 4 sets of points. It runs great on the points, and a spare set of points is way cheaper to keep on hand than spare electronic ignition units. That said, yes, it's true that electronic units are very reliable and usually don't fail, but I do go back to the KISS principle and like the idea that for about 15 bucks, I have everything in the glove box or spares box on the boat to redo the points (which don't fail either) versus having a much more expensive spares box with an extra ECU. I also feel that while we can beat the points versus electronic ignition horse until it's dead and bleeding in the road (like some other electrical discussions....), the RPM that we use our marine engines at ( 2-3000) is low compared to 7000+ RPM in some of these vintage gas engines i.e. we don't run the marine engines in scenarios that bring out the performance nuance of electronic ignition versus points - if your marine engine has no problems, unless you just want another project, leave the points alone and invest in sails (it's a sailboat after all).
Flame suite on - blast me if you will :0
Flame suite on - blast me if you will :0
Mmmmm.... Brimstone....!
Sheesh, David, Now the advocate for the Devil needs a flame suit?
:0
I do like the idea of simplicity, but would probably make the upgrade if I did have an A4. Why? Just 'cause I like trick gadgets... (no other reason worth any heat or flames.)
This discussion reminds of the the olden days when we could buy those new-fangled solid state ignition setups for our 50's/60's cars. I never did, but remember devouring the specs in the catalogs. Why, along with that super duper ignition, some headers, and a cold air intake for the carb, I could have doubled the horsepower! (In my wilder dreams...)
Imagine, an Ericson with lakes pipes!
A better ignition? -- I probably never needed one anyway if I'd just kept my beat up TR-3 or the Volvo 544 in decent tune. (Besides, balancing the SU's was actually the more difficult part of tuning...)
Cheers,
Loren
Sheesh, David, Now the advocate for the Devil needs a flame suit?
:0
I do like the idea of simplicity, but would probably make the upgrade if I did have an A4. Why? Just 'cause I like trick gadgets... (no other reason worth any heat or flames.)
This discussion reminds of the the olden days when we could buy those new-fangled solid state ignition setups for our 50's/60's cars. I never did, but remember devouring the specs in the catalogs. Why, along with that super duper ignition, some headers, and a cold air intake for the carb, I could have doubled the horsepower! (In my wilder dreams...)
Imagine, an Ericson with lakes pipes!
A better ignition? -- I probably never needed one anyway if I'd just kept my beat up TR-3 or the Volvo 544 in decent tune. (Besides, balancing the SU's was actually the more difficult part of tuning...)
Cheers,
Loren
Ah yes, balancing SU's - you bring back memories - fill her up with gas and check the oil in the carburetors - that would make the old full service gas station attendants give you another weird look 
I must admit that I am a big fan of capacitive discharge units like the ones from MSD ( http://www.msdignition.com/Products..._-_MSD-6T,_High_Performance-Circle_Track.aspx ), and have fitted them on many of my old creatures. I've got a pair of Delta Mark X's on the shelf - remember those? If I had an A4 that came to me with the electronic ignition upgrade, I'd leave it on also. But it's still fun to keep it "classic" with the points.
I must admit that I am a big fan of capacitive discharge units like the ones from MSD ( http://www.msdignition.com/Products..._-_MSD-6T,_High_Performance-Circle_Track.aspx ), and have fitted them on many of my old creatures. I've got a pair of Delta Mark X's on the shelf - remember those? If I had an A4 that came to me with the electronic ignition upgrade, I'd leave it on also. But it's still fun to keep it "classic" with the points.
Matey
Member III
A few thoughts on your conversion. I hear what’s said for staying w/points, but I converted. My reasons were these.
<O
</O
· I believe in reliable electronics. I don’t navigate with a sextant, I use my iPhone and a GPS. Moyer and Indigo have sold lots of electronic ignitions.. their businesses rely on them being dependable.. and the boys on their very active forum will be letting them know otherwise.
<O</O
The Ignitor system uses the "Hall effect" switching principle which is quite simple. It incorporates a plastic ring that installs over the rotor of the distributor shaft with small permanent magnets molded into it. As the distributor rotates, the magnets within the magnetic ring move past a small electronic module that opens and closes the primary ignition circuit to the coil. The entire magnetic switching device of the Ignitor installs within the distributor itself. The Ignitor is therefore quite simple and is very reliable. –Moyer-
<O</O
· Points when fresh work fine, however from that point on the performance decreases as they wear. The wear on the points changes dwell and contact condenser saturation
<O</O
· Access to the distributor on my A4 is very difficult. Setting new points regularly would be a real pain
<O</O
· My good friend and mechanic said without hesitation to change
<O</O
Mr. Dragon mentioned .. I am the proud new owner of a 1975 E29 with very limited knowledge of engines. Do you want to be setting your timing at regular tune-ups ?
<O</O
I highly recommend checking over at the Moyer Forum also. I’ve learned a ton from them, got help in pulling my engine to re-build and have nothing but good to say about Moyer’s parts. They spent over an hour advising me on the phone about my project. 3 years later my A4 runs like a watch. I hadn’t really wrenched on a gas motor since my 20’s. While admittedly I would have preferred a diesel, this little flathead has been fun and trustworthy.
<O</O
One facet of sailing I love is that if all this electromechanical stuff fails, I still have paper charts, a compass, a leadline and a properly rigged sloop to get me home.
My A4 blew the head gasket 5 miles from her delivery destination. I sailed her <O</O
Regards, Greg<O</O
<O
</O· I believe in reliable electronics. I don’t navigate with a sextant, I use my iPhone and a GPS. Moyer and Indigo have sold lots of electronic ignitions.. their businesses rely on them being dependable.. and the boys on their very active forum will be letting them know otherwise.
<O
</OThe Ignitor system uses the "Hall effect" switching principle which is quite simple. It incorporates a plastic ring that installs over the rotor of the distributor shaft with small permanent magnets molded into it. As the distributor rotates, the magnets within the magnetic ring move past a small electronic module that opens and closes the primary ignition circuit to the coil. The entire magnetic switching device of the Ignitor installs within the distributor itself. The Ignitor is therefore quite simple and is very reliable. –Moyer-
<O
</O· Points when fresh work fine, however from that point on the performance decreases as they wear. The wear on the points changes dwell and contact condenser saturation
<O
</O· Access to the distributor on my A4 is very difficult. Setting new points regularly would be a real pain
<O
</O· My good friend and mechanic said without hesitation to change
<O
</OMr. Dragon mentioned .. I am the proud new owner of a 1975 E29 with very limited knowledge of engines. Do you want to be setting your timing at regular tune-ups ?
<O
</OI highly recommend checking over at the Moyer Forum also. I’ve learned a ton from them, got help in pulling my engine to re-build and have nothing but good to say about Moyer’s parts. They spent over an hour advising me on the phone about my project. 3 years later my A4 runs like a watch. I hadn’t really wrenched on a gas motor since my 20’s. While admittedly I would have preferred a diesel, this little flathead has been fun and trustworthy.
<O
</OOne facet of sailing I love is that if all this electromechanical stuff fails, I still have paper charts, a compass, a leadline and a properly rigged sloop to get me home.
My A4 blew the head gasket 5 miles from her delivery destination. I sailed her <O
</ORegards, Greg<O
</OAttachments
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A4.jpg
Rocinante33
Contributing Partner
Good "points", Greg! Fogive the pun, but you did mention all the good ones.
Randy Rutledge
Sustaining Member
David the Delta ignition conversion, was that a build it yourself kit in a gold colored heat sink??? I built one in 1971; it was triggered from the points.
The dwell and timing don't seem to be that critical on the A-4 at leas compared to some of the performance engines I have worked on. I have never used anything other than eyeball gap check and set the timing by ear with the engine running, i believe that Moyer suggest time for fastest idle, I may be dreaming on that.
I converted my MasterCraft to electronics after many problems on the Ford marine conversion. Only problem with the conversion in 25 years was a lost magnet out of the ring that goes over the distributor cam. Had to buy a whole unit and converted the electronics to work on my A-4 with the ring Moyer sells. Keep the old distributor plate in a sealed bag or container as a spare, but you will never need it.
The dwell and timing don't seem to be that critical on the A-4 at leas compared to some of the performance engines I have worked on. I have never used anything other than eyeball gap check and set the timing by ear with the engine running, i believe that Moyer suggest time for fastest idle, I may be dreaming on that.
I converted my MasterCraft to electronics after many problems on the Ford marine conversion. Only problem with the conversion in 25 years was a lost magnet out of the ring that goes over the distributor cam. Had to buy a whole unit and converted the electronics to work on my A-4 with the ring Moyer sells. Keep the old distributor plate in a sealed bag or container as a spare, but you will never need it.
Mine came from Delta, but I also think I remember a kit from someone - not sure if it was them or someone like Heath. Here's what I've got.
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Delta_MarkTen8x6.jpg
DynamicDave
Member I
I'm a Moyer Marine Electronic convert....but
The electronic kit to convert your old wobbly spindled distributer will work much better in a new (rebuilt) Moyer distributer! I tried just the conversion kit first, broke 2 Magnetic collars (the correct ones I might add!) trying to slide them onto the old drive shaft. These are $25 each!
After that, in frustration,I went back to points. In a couple of months of just running the motor in and out of the marina, my points looked like they had pitted and engine performance had started to drop. Yes, my gap was correct, timing adjusted and new carb tuned. You really have to run an A4 to operating temp for awhile to dry out the condensation from the underside of the distributer cap!
Finally dropped a couple of hundred on the New/Rebuilt Moyer Distributer w/ electronics installed. What a huge improvement. Easy starts, best idle and a bit higher RPMs under power. Live and learn. I still have the older electronic harness for emergencies and the old points/condenser rebuilt distributer for second back up.
Had I gone w/ the new distributer/electronic package to start with, I'da been out $300.
Having screwed around with the first electronic kit, another collar, and an old (35yrs) distributer, add another $150!
FYI I'm using the 3 blade fixed Ingigo prop w/ good results (another $300) yikes!
And NO, I do not work for Moyer or Indigo! Just glad they're around.
My Bad! DB E32
The electronic kit to convert your old wobbly spindled distributer will work much better in a new (rebuilt) Moyer distributer! I tried just the conversion kit first, broke 2 Magnetic collars (the correct ones I might add!) trying to slide them onto the old drive shaft. These are $25 each!
After that, in frustration,I went back to points. In a couple of months of just running the motor in and out of the marina, my points looked like they had pitted and engine performance had started to drop. Yes, my gap was correct, timing adjusted and new carb tuned. You really have to run an A4 to operating temp for awhile to dry out the condensation from the underside of the distributer cap!
Finally dropped a couple of hundred on the New/Rebuilt Moyer Distributer w/ electronics installed. What a huge improvement. Easy starts, best idle and a bit higher RPMs under power. Live and learn. I still have the older electronic harness for emergencies and the old points/condenser rebuilt distributer for second back up.
Had I gone w/ the new distributer/electronic package to start with, I'da been out $300.
Having screwed around with the first electronic kit, another collar, and an old (35yrs) distributer, add another $150!
FYI I'm using the 3 blade fixed Ingigo prop w/ good results (another $300) yikes!
And NO, I do not work for Moyer or Indigo! Just glad they're around.
My Bad! DB E32