Very hard steering

[David Erickson]

1974 E29 Wheel steering. Never seen salt water.
2 years ago the wheel was free and the steering was easy.
Last year I noticed the steering wasn't so easy. It was as if the (pardon my lack of terminology) steering wheel brake wasn't completely loosened.
This year, and I due to issues ashore, I was able to visit "Lady Jane" only a half dozen times and the steering had become even more difficult.
Today, now on the hard, I decided to fix this once and for all. I thought.
The steering now feels as if the wheel brake is engaged, but it's not.
I removed the binnacle compass and inspected from the top. Everything looked good. No sign of wear, rust or corrosion at all, but the wheel still defied me.
Through the cockpit access hatch everything looked good. The quadrant seemed tightly attached to the rudder shaft. The steering cables had a little slack to them. I think they should be a little tighter, but shouldn't be the cause of the hard steering.
There is some vertical travel in the rudder shaft, about 1/2". Again, didn't seem quite right, but again didn't seem to be my problem.
I purchased a spray can of "Penetrating lithium lube".
It sprays a foam that looks like it would get into tight spaces.
I sprayed the wire rope sheave axel pins below and anything above that looked like it might cause friction.
All to no avail. It still took real effort to turn the wheel.

I buttoned everything up and left the boat in defeat.
As I climbed over the pushpit (?) my eye caught sight of the steering wheel shaft entering the binnacle.
The only place I hadn't sprayed with lube and probably the place I should have suspected first.
Tomorrow.

Until then...
Any words of wisdom and/or experience will be welcome.

Just saw a post regarding rudder post grease.
In my probing beneath the quadrant I felt a bolt? sticking out one side. Could be I zerk fitting.

I think I should have been following these posts BEFORE I had a problem.
A little more grease might have caused a little less grief.
(sorry about that)

 

[Bolo]

I have no real suggestions as to what your problem might be short of asking have you been greasing the rudder post by way of the zero fittings? But what does seem obvious is that this problem has been getting worse as time has gone on. I’m making an assumption that your boat is out of the water for the winter so this might be a good time to drop the rudder and give all the steering components a good going over. I‘m sure your problem will become obvious somewhere during the process. Just a suggestion but wait to see what others might say.

 

[Christian Williams]

Naturally your rudder isn't covered in a foot of glop and Zebra mussels. Sorry I asked.

Crawl under the cockpit and turn the quadrant by laying hands on it, even though it's hard to get leverage. You should be able to.

If not, loosen or detach the cables. Now the rudder isn't connected to the pedestal and all that friction, wheel brake, and so on. If you still can't budge it by the laying on of the hands, something is stiff in the rudder tube and post. Pump grease in there through the Zerk, although actually new grease can make the steering temporarily stiffer.

I'd eliminate the possibility the rudder hits the hull, since you mention a bit of vertical post movement, but I doubt that's it.

For what it's worth, gradually stiffer steering over time isn';t unusual. Glop builds. Your investigation's on the right track, or at least is what I'd be doing.

 

[jtsai]

Your steering pedestal shaft needle bearings require lubrication. Edson steering system has two lubricating points, fore and aft of the shaft. Not sure what type you have, but my last boat acted like this when the shaft bearing dried up.

 

[Mark David]

....a foot of glop and Zebra mussels....Glop builds...

what is the preferred lubricant? have used white lithium grease but that seems to attract the 'glop'

 

[Christian Williams]

The guts of the pedestal are fairly obvious, sprocket, chain, bearings, wheel shaft. I guess grease buildup there could muck up the works, and might as well consider it, but never really the problem for me. To check that stuff you could disconnect the cables, then the wheel should turn easily.
If not you could sluice the bearings with, say, PB Blaster, and after cleaning up the mess grease again. Or just oil. But you already made that inspection.

Forum wisdom is that there is often no grease left at all in the space between the rudder post and the rudder tube. Ericson put a Zerk grease fitting there, but they often rusted closed 20 years ago. A new Zerk is not very hard to install. I'm not sure grease in the tube helps with ease of steering, but it may. It also keeps water from penetrating the gland at top of rudder tube.

There's also a bearing at the top of the rudder post, which may have its own grease fitting. Most of us put some grease there too, as best we can.

On Zerk fittings I use the green marine grease from West Marine, in 3 oz. tubes, with a grease gun. I don't think the brand matters much.

Anyhow, isolate the problem by disconnecting the cables. If the wheel is slow to turn without the rudder connected, time to dive into disassembly of the pedestal and cleaning.

 

[David Erickson]

Thank you all for you wisdom and your assistance.
First thing this am was to isolate the rudder from the pedestal by loosening the wire ropes attached to the quadrant.
Thank God! The rudder is free. The thought of dropping the rudder had me quaking in my boots.
Except for some very old grease on the roller chain everything looks good. I sprayed the penetrating lithium on the shaft immediately behind the wheel.
There are 2 big slotted screws on the wheel shaft. One fore and one aft of all the roller chain, wheel brake, etc.
I thought they were for tensioning the wheel, but from one of the comments, now I think that's where I lube the wheel shaft.
I went aft of the wheel to force the wheel from amidships to hard port so I could see the "bolt" that might be a zerk fitting.
The wheel turned with very little effort - yea! - and the bolt is a indeed a zerk. I replaced it with a new one from an earlier brake job on my car and pumped fresh grease into it until I saw fresh grease coming out. I haven't greased it in the 5 years I've had her and I'll bet the PO didn't grease it at all either. Now she'll get a squirt at least every season.

It's in the low 40s with wet snow or cold rain falling. Glad I tented the boom with a tarp.
Time to button up everything an head home for a very hot shower.
Thank you again gentlemen.
I think I'll be paying closer attention to this site.
Point Marine, Muskegon, Michigan - out.

 

[nquigley]

I tried to grease my rudder shaft via the zerk a few years ago, but seem to recall having lots of trouble and giving up. I didn't think I was getting any grease in there. I ordred a new zerk, but didn't install it.
I decided recently to try again, but couldn't find my grease gun today. They're not very expensive (~$38 at Home Depot), so bought another today (that means the old one will show up any day).
About how much grease can the rudder shaft cavity accept?
I got about 3/4 of a 14oz cartridge in there and couldn't seem to get any more in there.

 

[Christian Williams]

I reckon that's pretty good. I can't get near that much into the current boat. I seem to recall about three of the little 3 oz. cartridges fit into the 32-3, which was mighty starved of lube at the time.

 

[nquigley]

Thank you!
Eventually …. I’ll drop the rudder to service it properly (before untying the lines at this time next year). Then I’ll be able to understand how the system is put together, and what care and feeding it needs

 

[RedDog]

Your steering pedestal shaft needle bearings require lubrication. Edson steering system has two lubricating points, fore and aft of the shaft. Not sure what type you have, but my last boat acted like this when the shaft bearing dried up.

My wheel is so seized the it takes great effort to turn the wheel. The shaft bearings must be really dry and corroded or something. Tomorrow I am going to see if I can remove the chain and sprocket to be able to pull the shaft out. Im hoping that someone who has done this will chime in. My E35 Mk2 is from 1972 and sat for 5 years before I bought it. Its pretty rough! but its my first sailboat at age 77 and I'm excited like a kid at Christmas!

 

[Christian Williams]

If you have Yacht Specialties/Merriman steering, these photos may help.

Yacht Specialties Pedestal Disassembly, with Photos [Master Thread]

(Yacht Specialties/Merriman binnacle steering manual: https://ericsonyachts.org/ie/resources/merriman-binnacle-catalog.187/ ) ( Edson pedestals: https://backwinded.wordpress.com/2015/12/07/replacing-the-diesel-engines-throttle-shift-and-stop-cables/ also Edson 335 pedestal with Yanmar 3YM30...

ericsonyachts.org

​

 

[RedDog]

If you have Yacht Specialties/Merriman steering, these photos may help.

Yacht Specialties Pedestal Disassembly, with Photos [Master Thread]

(Yacht Specialties/Merriman binnacle steering manual: https://ericsonyachts.org/ie/resources/merriman-binnacle-catalog.187/ ) ( Edson pedestals: https://backwinded.wordpress.com/2015/12/07/replacing-the-diesel-engines-throttle-shift-and-stop-cables/ also Edson 335 pedestal with Yanmar 3YM30...

ericsonyachts.org

​

 

[RedDog]

Thanks!! That thread is excellent but the photos start with the wheel already removed. Need inf on his to remove the wheel and shaft.

 

[Loren Beach]

On our '88 Yacht specialties steering, I remove the large nut that holds the wheel on the shaft and then slide the wheel off, being careful not to lose the 'key' that it slides onto via the milled channel in the shaft.
You also need to see -close up - the sheaves under the steering that turn the cables 90 degrees to send them to the quadrant. Those sheaves probably have a pressed in oiled bronze bushing in each one. I had to replace both bushings one time. Also, if the cables ever get slack enough for the cables to jump the sheave, steering would be really difficult, if even still possible.

 

[Christian Williams]

If with the nut removed the wheel resists coming off, make a temporary wheel-puller. Just place a 2x4 or similar across the shaft, and two C clamps on opposing spokes. Tighten C-clamps.

 

[Touchrain]

1974 E29 Wheel steering. Never seen salt water.
2 years ago the wheel was free and the steering was easy.
Last year I noticed the steering wasn't so easy. It was as if the (pardon my lack of terminology) steering wheel brake wasn't completely loosened.
This year, and I due to issues ashore, I was able to visit "Lady Jane" only a half dozen times and the steering had become even more difficult.
Today, now on the hard, I decided to fix this once and for all. I thought.
The steering now feels as if the wheel brake is engaged, but it's not.
I removed the binnacle compass and inspected from the top. Everything looked good. No sign of wear, rust or corrosion at all, but the wheel still defied me.
Through the cockpit access hatch everything looked good. The quadrant seemed tightly attached to the rudder shaft. The steering cables had a little slack to them. I think they should be a little tighter, but shouldn't be the cause of the hard steering.
There is some vertical travel in the rudder shaft, about 1/2". Again, didn't seem quite right, but again didn't seem to be my problem.
I purchased a spray can of "Penetrating lithium lube".
It sprays a foam that looks like it would get into tight spaces.
I sprayed the wire rope sheave axel pins below and anything above that looked like it might cause friction.
All to no avail. It still took real effort to turn the wheel.

I buttoned everything up and left the boat in defeat.
As I climbed over the pushpit (?) my eye caught sight of the steering wheel shaft entering the binnacle.
The only place I hadn't sprayed with lube and probably the place I should have suspected first.
Tomorrow.

Until then...
Any words of wisdom and/or experience will be welcome.

Just saw a post regarding rudder post grease.
In my probing beneath the quadrant I felt a bolt? sticking out one side. Could be I zerk fitting.

I think I should have been following these posts BEFORE I had a problem.
A little more grease might have caused a little less grief.
(sorry about that)

My 38 had a bolt that should have been a zerk. You need pressure to get the grease in. Made a big difference. Also, there are one or two zerks on the rudder post area.