water in the bilge

[vasuvius]

I think it's time I found the cause and fixed it.
The boat went into the water 2 and a 1/2 weeks ago and today was the first time I had time to go to the boat since then.
For the past few days it's rained quite a bit and the weather has been rough - 20-30kn winds, and choppy.

The bilge pump fuse blew and I had 15+ gallons of water in the bilge. About 1" below the cabin sole. Guess I got lucky this time.

I'm going to look into installing this : https://lifeempirically.com/2018/03/12/build-your-own-diy-arid-bilge-or-dry-bilge-system/

Can anyone provide suggestions on smart ways to troubleshoot where the water is coming in from ? I think it's rain water and more. I've checked the anchor locker and drain tube - it looks fine. I still have to inspect all the hoses for the cockpit drains, the bilge pump hose etc. Hopefully this weekend.

Thanks
Vasu

 

[Parrothead]

Of at least equal or perhaps even greater importance is to find out why the bilge pump overcurrent protection tripped/blew. You want that system rock solid reliable especially while the boat is unattended.

 

[Loren Beach]

IF you have a keel stepped mast, rain water comes down the inside of the spar. We can get a quart in a day or more when it's stormy.

 

[Frank Langer]

My Jabsco bilge pump blew a fuse a couple times in the past. I phoned the Jabsco tech dept. and they told me that the rubber impeller can swell a bit, causing it to bind and blow a fuse. The solution was to lightly sand the flat edges a bit. It hasn't blown a fuse since then.
But there can be other reasons for it to fail, so careful checking of wiring, connections, etc. is still important.
Frank

 

[KS Dave]

I have insurance in the form of a Blink camera pointed at an open bilge compartment. I can check in on it any time I need to.

 

[Felicity]

I think it's time I found the cause and fixed it.
The boat went into the water 2 and a 1/2 weeks ago and today was the first time I had time to go to the boat since then.
For the past few days it's rained quite a bit and the weather has been rough - 20-30kn winds, and choppy.

The bilge pump fuse blew and I had 15+ gallons of water in the bilge. About 1" below the cabin sole. Guess I got lucky this time.

I'm going to look into installing this : https://lifeempirically.com/2018/03/12/build-your-own-diy-arid-bilge-or-dry-bilge-system/

Can anyone provide suggestions on smart ways to troubleshoot where the water is coming in from ? I think it's rain water and more. I've checked the anchor locker and drain tube - it looks fine. I still have to inspect all the hoses for the cockpit drains, the bilge pump hose etc. Hopefully this weekend.

Thanks
Vasu

I had a situation where my ‘dripless’ engine shaft somehow got loosened and water was gushing in overnight, filled the bilge. It took 2 min to tighten the clamps responsible, but could have been a disaster if the boat had been left unattended for a period of time. I got lucky I was living on boat at time.

 

[vasuvius]

Of at least equal or perhaps even greater importance is to find out why the bilge pump overcurrent protection tripped/blew. You want that system rock solid reliable especially while the boat is unattended.

Water in the bilge loosens crud and gunk which get through the pump strainer and impede the float switch.
The pump is a Seaflo pump with built in float switch.
I cleaned out the strained and wiped the pump, float clean and it worked fine after that.

I wonder if a 'finer' strainer like a cheese cloth or something around the pump strainer will help or make it harder for the pump to pull water.

I haven't had time (yet) to inspect the hose to see if there's any issues with it.

 

[vasuvius]

IF you have a keel stepped mast, rain water comes down the inside of the spar. We can get a quart in a day or more when it's stormy.

I have a deck stepped mast. And strangely, I don't see any water stains inside the boat that could indicate where the ingress is from.
I do know that rain water gets in from the deck. But, given the amount of water in the past 2.5 weeks, I think there's another ingress from under the water line.
We're traveling for the next 10 days, so, at this point I have 1 morning left to figure out something and then just pray it doesn't get worse.

 

[vasuvius]

I have insurance in the form of a Blink camera pointed at an open bilge compartment. I can check in on it any time I need to.

View attachment 42870

My boat is at a mooring about 300 yards from the clubhouse. I don't get wifi out that far to run a blink camera :-(
I do have the same pump as yours in the 1100 gph size.

 

[Parrothead]

Water in the bilge loosens crud and gunk which get through the pump strainer and impede the float switch.
The pump is a Seaflo pump with built in float switch.
I cleaned out the strained and wiped the pump, float clean and it worked fine after that.

I wonder if a 'finer' strainer like a cheese cloth or something around the pump strainer will help or make it harder for the pump to pull water.

I haven't had time (yet) to inspect the hose to see if there's any issues with it.

I'm doubtful any of what you describe would directly cause an overcurrent condition sufficient to pop a fuse or breaker. Speaking of which, I see no mention that you either replaced a fuse or reset a breaker, only "I cleaned out the strained and wiped the pump, float clean and it worked fine after that." In the opening post you stated clearly "The bilge pump fuse blew. . . ." and yet I'm reading nothing about tracing and checking wiring. What am I missing?

 

[Loren Beach]

Aside from finding the leak.... One other factor is the pump itself. Centrifugal pumps, by design, can only work well under very specific conditions, jam easily, and are dirt-cheap.
When/if they jam, they (hopefully) trip the breaker, avoiding a fire. That's a good thing.

EY installed a much more expensive pump in our '88. Positive displacement Jabsco. Less theoretical flow, but much more reliable output at the stated GPM.
Larger curiosity is where significant water is coming from. if you rule out the stuffing box, then look for a deck source. If there is a loose deck fill that lets rain run in along the side deck that might be the place. Or, back to rain again, is there a break in an ancient cockpit drain hose that allows rain water from that area to go into the bilge?
Loose thruhull valve base fitting?
Let us know what you find.
Good luck.

 

[vasuvius]

I'm doubtful any of what you describe would directly cause an overcurrent condition sufficient to pop a fuse or breaker. Speaking of which, I see no mention that you either replaced a fuse or reset a breaker, only "I cleaned out the strained and wiped the pump, float clean and it worked fine after that." In the opening post you stated clearly "The bilge pump fuse blew. . . ." and yet I'm reading nothing about tracing and checking wiring. What am I missing?

Sorry, I missed mentioning that. The first thing I checked was the fuse. It was blown. I replaced the fuse after pumping out the water, then cleaning the pump parts.
You bring up a good point - I did not trace the wires to see if there was any damage that could cause a short. And now I'm wondering what could have caused the current draw to blow the fuse.
Is it possible that water sloshing around could get to some nick or cut in the wires and cause a short ? I need to check that

 

[Parrothead]

Is it possible that water sloshing around could get to some nick or cut in the wires and cause a short ? I need to check that

Absolutely and dozens of other possibilities too. With electrical it's often the case that replacing suspect wiring is a more efficient use of your time than tracing and repairing it.

 

[Christian Williams]

a break in an ancient cockpit drain hose that allows rain water from that area to go into the bilge...

My #1 check.

Also, a tip-of-the-finger taste will tell instantly whether the bilge is salt or fresh. That's really where to start.

 

[Felicity]

My boat is at a mooring about 300 yards from the clubhouse. I don't get wifi out that far to run a blink camera :-(
I do have the same pump as yours in the 1100 gph size.

In your position I might buy a little hotspot, which can stay powered off you DC, and to get internet to your boat. I recently bought a Glocalme, its looks like a cellphone but connects without a simcard, to local mobile towers. The data is also pay as you go, so no data contracts…

 

[KS Dave]

I don't get wifi out that far to run a blink camera :-(

We don't have club/marina-provided Wi-Fi, so I use a Verizon hotspot. It's about $10/month as an add-on to my existing plan.

 

[southofvictor]

Is the water fresh or salty? Where’s your transducer, could water be getting in there?

We‘ve gotten a lot of water in through our mast this spring, and I think I need to clean out our weep holes because flow between chambers doesn’t seem to be very good.

We have a Jabsco Par diaphragm pump and I’ve been a little concerned about the flow rate vs something like a Rule2000 but I haven’t measured the rise and figured out how much flow we’d lose with a centerfuge pump. Does anyone have a dual pump setup with both a diaphragm and a centerfuge? Is that overkill?

 

[Christian Williams]

It's overkill because a bilge pump is only for rainwater. And in my opinion diaphragm bilge pumps are much more reliable that submersibles. Any real leak requires the manual cockpit diaphragm pump--or a gas pump lowered by a helicopter.

 

[Loren Beach]

Is the water fresh or salty? Where’s your transducer, could water be getting in there?

We‘ve gotten a lot of water in through our mast this spring, and I think I need to clean out our weep holes because flow between chambers doesn’t seem to be very good.

We have a Jabsco Par diaphragm pump and I’ve been a little concerned about the flow rate vs something like a Rule2000 but I haven’t measured the rise and figured out how much flow we’d lose with a centerfuge pump. Does anyone have a dual pump setup with both a diaphragm and a centerfuge? Is that overkill?

In my younger and more naive days I tried a Rule centrifugal pump for a year. After more research into their bogus ad hype about GPH, and one hard sail where a bunch of water back-syphoned into our bilge, I reinstalled a Jabsco pump. As Christian sez, all of these pumps are there to remove nuisance water. They will help gain you some time if you have a major hole in the bottom, but that's about about most pumps can do.

I suspect that's why the Navy emphasizes "damage control" rather than pumping. Reducing or stopping the inflow of water is the #1 priority.

ps: regularly check the coarse filter in the little plastic housing that Jabsco provided that is located between the strum box and the pump. I suspect that some of us ignore it for years at a time. I will give props to EY for using wire-reinforced black 3/4 hose for the runs from those pumps.

 

[Kenneth K]

Does anyone have a dual pump setup with both a diaphragm and a centerfuge? Is that overkill?

I have three electric pumps in three different bilge sections, three automatic switches, two manual switches, and a valve that lets me route one pump to two different intake hoses. I set the system up differently for summer and winter use. I'll also have the manual whale gusher in the cockpit, once I replace the old damaged one.

I think a bilge pump system should handle more than just rain water. While one can always play the game where one creates a disaster larger than any bilge pump can handle, multiple bilge pumps will buy you some time, and some redundancy. That could make the difference between minor and major damage.