Got Design Questions?

[Shamwari]

Plans request

Sven
I have e-39 hull 60 and would really like to get a copy of your plans. I work on AutoCAD all day and wouldn't mind converting them so everyone who needs information could get it.
I've been drawing parts of my e-39 and older e-27 every time I want to build something for the boat, but would sure like to have the full set.
John Gleadle
super07@telus.net

 

[mmackof]

Me too!

I would welcome a copy of the plans as is and most definitely if redrawn.

Mort Hull 57

 

[Sven]

Sven, Something just doesn't sound right there?

That's why I asked in the first place

The drawings are dated 1-70. I've attached a picture below. It must have been a working drawing or a draft.


-Sven

 

[Sven]

a copy of your plans

They aren't mine to give away since they should still be covered by Bruce King's IP rights for another 10 years ? I think it is 50 years, right ?

Martin, that's another question for your dad and mom. Does your dad mind copies being made if someone were to do so ? The question for your mom (who I don't want to bother yet again) is if she's still willing to sell copies ?

BTW, the plans are mainly of the hull and bulkhead design, not the interior or joinery work.


-Sven

 

[HughHarv]

That's why I asked in the first place

The drawings are dated 1-70. I've attached a picture below. It must have been a working drawing or a draft.


-Sven

I'd add a couple of scuppers aft, help get the water out if ever pooped. Which brings up another subject, how big of a wave would it take to actually poop a 39 or 39B? Scarey! I only have drawing of the rudder mod for the 39 series. Would be interesting to see all available drawings posted for all boats on this website.

 

[Sven]

I'd add a couple of scuppers aft, help get the water out if ever pooped. Which brings up another subject, how big of a wave would it take to actually poop a 39 or 39B? Scarey! I only have drawing of the rudder mod for the 39 series. Would be interesting to see all available drawings posted for all boats on this website.

The scuppers are aft which is why I was asking why the drawings showed them forward ... were they ever forward or was that just a working drawing ?

One of the mods I'd like is to plumb the scuppers to 2" throughhulls above waterline .


-Sven

 

[fidji]

mast step

When I bought my boat the surveyer told me that there is two design flaw on my Ericson 35 mkIII the mast step is to week under high mast compression and give some slack to the shrouds and the rudder post tube had to be reinforce , do you know any problems that happens concerning those points
Eric
Ericson 35 MK III
Hull#112

 

[treilley]

First time I have ever heard of either of those issues. I get slack lee shrouds when in 18+ kts of wind. My rudder tube seems plenty beefy and I have never heard of any failures there.

Would you mind scanning and posting those sections of your survey so we can get the surveyor's exact wording?

 

[fidji]

design flaw

He did not write this comment down he simply told me (verbally)that during the inspection.
Eric

 

[Seth]

What a load of BS

To your surveryor I say "NOT"...

In it's class this is one of the best structural boats on the water.

The TAFG ties in the chainplates and mast step loads to the whole fore and aft and athwartships structure, which really does a pretty good job of minimizing point loading. I am sure TReilly can tell you he sails with a fair amount of hydraulic backstay on when conditions warrant, and I am sure his mast step is sound.

I would go so far as to guess this guy did not know what he was looking at, or had the boat confused with some other design. If he WAS thinking of an Ericson he might have been thinking 35-II, which was a little sensitive in this area (a pre-TAFG design with a deck stepped mast and offset support beam below decks). But he is way off base with this comment for your boat.

With respect to the lee shrouds, ALL masthead rigged boats with in-line spreaders will have unloaded lee shrouds, and in any breeze they will appear slack. If you are the type to change rig tune for the conditions, you will see more or less of this effect depending on conditions, but for a cruiser or club racer who chooses a rig setting and leaves it, there will be times when you notice this-NOT a problem.

Weak rudder post? Nope. Unless the particular boat was built on a Friday afternoon, and has a defect, this is not a design flaw at all. According to the construction schedule this is a beefy, well reinforced structure as well.

Not that I have an opinion...

Cheers,
S:nerd:

 

[treilley]

He did not write this comment down he simply told me (verbally)that during the inspection.
Eric

Luckily Eric you purchased a great boat in spite of the surveyor. He did not do his job properly if he made such a statement and did not include it in your written survey.

Did he actually look at these two areas? Did he notice that your 20+ year old boat had a perfectly intact mast step and rudder tube? If there was a problem here it should have been obvious as the grid work below the step would be stressed.

You can sleep better now knowing that my boat was heavily raced for years and none the worse for wear.

The only weak point I have seen in this boat and a couple other designs is the structure around the aft end of the anchor locker. Stress cracks in the gelcoat will start to form here after many years. Not sure if this was due to design or construction though.

 

[fidji]

good design

Thank's Seth I had the presentiment that you are going to intervene and that is what I'm waiting for , because I know that you are the right person with the expertise to made the final point. Like you said I never Had problems with both and I just want to know if I'm not the lone lucky one I had contacted Webb Chiles who own two Ericson a 35-2 and a 37 cutter and he told me that he haven't any problems of that type in his 35-2 but he had serious problem of other type with is 37 nothing relevant to my boat. But I saw in a technical note from Ericson that for some boat there is a problem with the internal grid stringers, in some case they deform under load and to solve the problem they recommend to place a stainless steel plate on each side of the stringer and thru bolted them , do you know anyting about that arfter market technical advise?
Best regars
Eric Meunier
Eric's son 35-3 #112

 

[Roger]

Actually . . . there were occasional problems with the mast support on the earlier E35-3's - see www.ericsonyachts.org/infoexchange/showthread.php?t=2356. A modification was implemented in the mid 80's (don't recall what hull no.) to correct the problem.
-Roger
www.rbrown-navalarchitect.com

 

[erikwfab]

A couple questions for BK

Martin,
1. Which 36C hull # did your parents own?

2. Given that the 36C was a unique design combining traditional topsides, if you will, with modern underwater form, what kind of testing was done to get it so right? from the drafting table were tank models built and tested then a mold and full size prototype.....or was she drawn, stamped and put into production, next....

3. 30+ years later are there any design changes to the rig or interior your father could apply to the 36C? Not to imply there were design flaws or to create a stampede of owners hauling, rerigging, changing their boats, but what feasable upgrades if any, could he suggest to an owner?

4. Want to go for a sail? If you and or your father are ever in the neighborhood of the Unda Maris, give a couple good raps on the hull and we'll throw the lines off.

 

[Seth]

Thanks Roger

Thanks for chiming in on this-and for the info. I should have been clear in adding the phrase ".....that I am aware of", which I usually do when this is the case.

Most production models by most builders (J boats, Pearson, even Hinckley and Swan) have had occasional problems like this-which are not design flaws (of course that can happen too!), but quality problems with a particular series of hull#'s.

Since the repair bulletin was issued shortly after production began, I would bet this has been corrected on any affected boats by now, I would still stand by my opinion that these are not "well known" problems with the model, however-but certainly acknowledge your point.

Please check in more often, we don't have a regular NA contributing on the site. Adding this perspective would be great for all of the owners and supporters who lurk here.

Thanks!

S

 

[fidji]

rudder post

Thank you Mr. Roger, now I know that I have to check those mast step stringers regularly. As a former chief engineer for Ericson do you think that it is totally impossible that the distance between the underneath cockpit floor and the inside face of the hull increase momentarily during a bad storm and bumpy sea causing the upper rudder post tube to jump out of the upper brass bushing,that is placed on the cockpit floor, that ordeal will impose too much stress on the fiberglass rudder post tube and that tube will bend and break loose and this will have for effect to sink the boat.
Eric
Eric's son 35-3 #112

 

[Roger]

Whoa, that’s a scary scenario! I can’t imagine the cockpit moving enough to disengage the upper rudder bearing unless there are already some other structural issues going on. The worst case I can see is some binding of the upper bearing in heavy conditions. A large “T” shaped cockpit can “float” slightly relative to the hull, and in fact on one of the models (can’t recall if it was the 35-3 or 38) somewhere along the line we added some partial bulkheads to stiffen the cockpit athwartships.

-Roger

www.rbrown-navalarchitect.com

 

[Seth]

What he said

I'm with RB on this-and while anything is possible, but if you see that much movement, something is wrong-either from damage or from a possible manufacturing defect (hey, they happen, but usually are corrected before too much time goes by) where the cockpit was not properly secured to the hull (technically I mean the deck to hull, but there are certain points of attachment on the cockpit).
If you notice this type of movment you need to have it looked at right away.

This is definitely not what you should be seeing!

Cheers,
S

 

[fidji]

upper bushing

I never see any movement like this on my boat but being intuitive and intelligent I see the potential of disaster without beeing caught by it, my observation was the thing that trigger my mind and push myself to ask such a question to a former chief engineer
Thank you
Eric
Eric's son 35-3 #112

 

[SAM]

E-28 vs E-28+

Vikings,

Ever wonder why the waterlines forward in the 38 are hollow?
Or why only 70 or so 31's were ever built?
I'm doing research on the history of Ericson and will be interviewing my
father about his 30 year relationship with that company. If you have
Ericson specific design questions, post them here, and I will do my
best to get the answers.

Martin

Dear Martin,
My question to your dad is why the E-28+ design was abandoned in 1996 for the newer E-28 design? What were the main reasons behind the design change and what were the changes beyond the obvious dimensions shown on this great site.
I would also like to know from your dad in retrospect would there be any changes he would suggest to modify, change or upgade the E-28 as it stood in 1990 when production ceased.
Thank you sincerely,
Sam of "Nauti Jo"