E29 - hole in mast from corrosion

[dm2659]

I saw a early 70's boat last weekend with corrosion on the mast from where the winches had been. All 6 of the 1/4" bolt holes were corroded as was the whole area. This is the case on both port and strbd sides of the spar. But one of the holes has corroded to the size of a penny and is jagged.

The seller said that this could be fixed by riveting aluminum plates over the areas where the winches were. But I want a boat with offshore potential - would this fix compromise integrity?

Thank you

 

[jkenan]

Before buying this boat, you should have it surveyed, and in this case, absolutely with the mast down (many surveyors will use binoculars to inspect the rigging if the mast is up). The corrossion is caused by dissimilar metals (stainless screws and aluminium spar) being in direct contact with each other for a period of time (and in this case, probably a long time). If it has gotton so bad to create a penny-sized hole, chances are it has also occurred farther up the mast where you can't see it right now.

As far as fixes go, you can weld a reinforcement plate (commonly a solution to corroded spreader boots - search for threads on that subject, you should find alot), but I would stay away from rivets as salt can get between the surfaces and create more problems.

Whatever boat you get, you should spend the time to apply anti-sieze compound to all stainless fasteners mounted to your spars. This will inhibit the corrossion that, you now know, can be very damaging.

Get that survey, especially if you are serious about taking this boat offshore. Good luck.

 

[Kevin Johnston]

Corrosion

Best case for the lowest cost and you maybe able to have a aluminum welder do a good job of patching the hole. This would be much better than a patch riveted in place and would prevent future damage and be more structurally strong.

But if your are seriously considering some ocean blue time, given the standing rig is most likely original and now 35+ years old, you may need to make this the priority instead of just a repair. Being ocean blue with a compromised standing rig would not be something I would want to take a chance on. A good survey may help you make this decision along with the price of the boat. I would make this a high priority.
KJ

 

[Chad and Sandy]

Corrosion and anti-size

I just read Johns idea of using anti-size on screws, pop rivets, and the like. I have often wondered if the metal in anti-size would cause a galvanic reaction in a marine environment or not. Does anybody have an answer for this question?

Fair winds,

Chad

 

[Guy Stevens]

Yes

Each formulation of anti seize is for a specific set of metal alloys. There is no one fits all. The least common of the available products is the aluminum one, as far as I know Permatex the owners of anti seize brand name stopped producing the product for aluminum some time ago.

The best solution is a product called Ultra Tef Gel. (Don't get the tech gel at west marine, it is a knock off product that does not work 1/2 as well.) Ultra Tef Gel is a hydrolyzed grease product with added ptfe. It is really good at preventing electrolysis. Another product that should be in your rigging bag is gas pipe tape. Available from any good hardware store, the 20mil is better than the 10 mil, but either will do. When you cut the tape remember to leave at least 1/16 of an inch around the item to be mounted. This will appear as a slightly black border if you look really close, but it will prevent stailess steel parts from having electrolysis around the edges that would still happen if you cut the tape off flush with the parts.

Guy

 

[jkenan]

This is why I love this board... I never would have known there were different types of anti-sieze compound. I was told, just like I'm telling the next guy, to use 'it'... period, the end. But you can also understand my disdain for this board, because now I have to go and re-do all my fasteners....

With knowledge, comes burden... I'd rather have it than not.

Thanks Guy(s).

 

[NateHanson]

I've always used the blue Loc-Tite thread locker for my machine screws into the mast. And I put shrink wrap plastic under the surface of things like winches or brackets attached to the mast.

I was nervous about the metal in anti-seize being a problem. I save that stuff for installing spark plugs. I too had no idea there were alloy-specific formulations.

 

[Brisdon]

I use silicon rubber on the threads and the back of what ever I'm bedding. Seems to isolate the metals as well as anything I've tried. I try to go with slot screws or hex. Better tork. I could strip a philips screw backing it out of a lemon merangue pie. I just have bad Philips Karma.

 

[NateHanson]

I use silicon rubber on the threads and the back of what ever I'm bedding. Seems to isolate the metals as well as anything I've tried. I try to go with slot screws or hex. Better tork. I could strip a philips screw backing it out of a lemon merangue pie. I just have bad Philips Karma.

When you can find it, square drive is KING! Really, it's enough to make you wonder why anything else is still used.

 

[tenders]

> When you can find it, square drive is KING!
> Really, it's enough to make you wonder why anything else is still used.

Oh brother. Another rabid square-drive evangelist, right here among us on the Ericson list. I know where we're headed: "All users of traditional screws are going straight to hell." "There's a conspiracy afoot from the powerful flathead lobby to keep the square drive out of Home Depots, Lowes, and West Marines and away from all American citizens." "Philips drives are a time bomb introduced by the Communists during the beginnings of the Cold War to cause the capitalist infrastructure to strip and eventually crumble." Yadda yadda yadda.

If you have a mailing address and a boat, sooner or later it will be impossible NOT to be overwhelmed by the pseudo-Irish down-hominess of square-drive screws. That's because McFeelys will track you down and never get out of your house. Their catalogs, that is.
http://www.mcfeelys.com/

I ask you: if square drive screws are so great, then why does McDonald's use TRIANGLE drive screws in all their Happy Meal toys, hmmmm?

 

[Brisdon]

I believe the Mc Donalds happy toy triangle drive is a symbol of the holy trinity between fat, salt, and sugar. What a wonderful rant on screws. Just what I needed today to cheer me up. Thanks guys!

 

[sleather]

More Tools!

Now that I've spent half-a-lifetime mastering "phillips" head fasteners, something NEW comes along(square drive)!

Thank the "higher-powers" for the chuckable, replaceable bit!

I've got Sooo many "toasted" phillips screwdrivers that I've taken to cutting the tip off and turning them into "punches"!

Square drive and hex-head drivers can @ least be "retipped"!

 

[NateHanson]

Oh brother. Another rabid square-drive evangelist, right here among us on the Ericson list.

Hmm. Didn't mean to be evangelising. I just like square drive. Don't have to provide downward pressure to keep the bit in the fastener the way you do with straight or philips bits.

 

[sleather]

Grain of Salt!

Nate, I'm sure "tenders" RANT was TIC, if not, take it with a "grain-of-salt"(like the tri-drive)! I think they're a GOOD idea(SQ)!

 

[NateHanson]

I'm pro-fastener-choice, so I wouldn't want anyone to think I was imposing my political opinions on others.

 

[Emerald]

What, you said that fastener was a square round triangle hex circle drive? Well, pass that there sawz-all ....

 

[tenders]

100 years of unrequited genius from the Canadinazis in the fastener business

I positively HATE the way the square-drive skinheads try to persuade others with facts, and benefits, and logical arguments. This time it's the freaking Canadians, who get a little currency appreciation against the US dollar so we can't call theirs the "Northern Peso" any more, and look what happens -- they start propagandizing Esquire magazine. It's just a matter of time before they stream over the Rainbow Bridge and take over Buffalo. Then where will we be??? Can Detroit be far behind???

Do any of the Presidential candidates use square drives to build their political platforms? Heck no! Bring it up at the next debate and they'll pretend they don't even know what you're talking about. It's un-American, that's why.

http://www.esquire.com/features/man-at-his-best/robertson-screwdriver-0308

Canadians will be celebrating an important anniversary this year, and like most of our anniversaries, we’ll be celebrating it largely alone. A century ago, a traveling salesman named Peter L. Robertson invented a new kind of screwdriver -- and its companion screw -- so prompted after he sliced himself silly with a flathead. Today, his namesake No. 2 remains the Canadian handyman’s standard: A square head with a point, it is a design so simple and perfect that your eschewing it bewilders us. The Robertson never slips, and it never strips, and it can be driven one-handed with nary a wobble. And while there are pockets of reported Robertson activity in Florida, Texas, and Indiana, thanks mostly to the freethinking folks in the RV industry, you’re probably missing it from your toolbox, and that’s an even greater national tragedy than your ugly money. In a recent ranking of great Canadian inventions, the Robertson ranked seventh, ahead of the zipper and the retractable beer-carton handle, just one spot behind the pacemaker. But the Robertson is the real lifesaver, rescuing us from both flatheads and Henry M. Phillips’s vastly inferior product. That sham artist actually had the nerve to suggest that his screwdrivers were designed to slip, to prevent “over-tightening.” Up here, there’s no such word.