E38 main measurements

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stbdtack

Member III
Loren, the sail is 43.25 on the P, and about 13.2 on the E. Good foot measure but I think its too tall for your Olson. Total sqft is about 328. Its a beautiful sail and my nasty weather helm has all but disappeared as others have commented on.

BTW, The fabric is considered their performance cruising version because it has a dacron taffeta on one side to balance out the Spectra/Pentex on the other side of the carbon. Doyle said it is outperforming their regular race cloths and will last a lot longer.

Harold, I have to ask Bill what hes thinking of. He said he may have someone local that wants it but he didnt mention that last time we talked. I will probably speak with him this weekend. I'll keep you posted.:oops:
 
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Seth

Sustaining Partner
Max girths

As far as those measurements on the new Q main, the midgirth is an inch or so under max (no biggie), and the upper is .01 under-which is viturally max size.

After reading my other post, I may owe an apology to the group..

MOST, but not ALL boats with aspect ratios like the 38, will not allow a max girth main to fit "under" the triangle without contacting the backstay. And it has been a while since I sailed on a racing 38.

If those are indeed the numbers, then you DO have a max girth sail, and be happy happy happy it does not hang up or touch the backstay.

I was not suggesting anyone complain to their sailmaker because the sail is NOT hanging up-my point was that for most boats this is a necessary inconvenience of having a full sized sail-and my suggestion was NOT to complain if it DID hit the backstay.

I can see how it looked that I was suggesting this be the measure of whether the sail is full sized or not, and that is not true-what determines this is the actual measurement-just that on most boats this is the case.:oops:

One thing: If the sail is not raised all the way up, or is short on the luff, then a max girth sail that would normally hit the backstay will not do so unless fully hoisted.

So, good news all around! Full size mainsail does not hit the backstay..

No problem at all.

As for sail areas (460 vs. 490), be careful here, too. Most brochures indicate a mainsail area strictly as a function of the area defined by 1/2 B X H, or P X E X.5. Also most cruising sail pricing programs use the same formula for calculating the price-and both of these obviously don't take "roach" area into account. So, you have to add the area of the triangle to the area in the roach to get the true area. The sailmakers design sheets will indictae actual area based on the roach percentage used in the design, but the price sheet may or may not. I am guessing the 460 number comes from a brochure or price sheet and the 490 may have come from the sailmaker in response to a specific question about that sail-or that sailmaker may have a price formula that allows a "roach" percentage entry, and calculated area accordingly..
Thoroughly confused? Hope so!:devil:

Finally-NICE shot of a GORGEOUS main!! Looks perfect for 0-8 knots of breeze, but a bit full for windy days. I hope you have enough throw on the backstay to flatten this out (along with max outhaul) when it gets breezy-because a sail that full will be backwinding pretty badly upwind in bigger breeze, and tipping you over. If you need a bit more bend when the adjuster is fully loaded, ease the aft lowers and tighten the fwd lowers accordingly-this will allow the bottom section of the mast to bend more!! But if it goes from this view to very flat with the controls you have, it is perfect!!!

Cheers,

S
 
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stbdtack

Member III
My head is starting to hurt from all this, lol.
So after chatting with Doyle yesterday, the max roach main will just "kiss" the backstay. Before, the max sail would overlap by a couple of inches. I'm not sure anyone really knows until the sail is actually hoisted.

On top of that Doyle says: Roach amt.=1.35ft @ 65%. Not sure if that is perpindicular to the head/clew line or parallel to the foot. Yet another dimension "somewhere up there"

On Sail area, Doyles design sheet gives projected area(plan view), molded area(Actual area of cloth) and Total area(cloth needed before seams) And then there is the set-back from the mast for the Harken cars.......

I need a nap.

If I can get someone to hoist me up the mast, I'm going to measure at the Mast crane and get the exact dimensions of the backstay position. I will draw it up on SolidWorks and then get the exact position for any dimension on the sail. I guess in the end it is what it is. I'm replacing the backstay with PBO so the sail should slide right off the slick cover of the stay.

Seth you are right on with the observation. I was in about 8-10 knots of wind with the backstay loose and the outhaul eased just a bit. I have my fwd lowers pretty tight and can get a good bend when I pump the backstay tight. The sail flattens right out.

I guess I'm not going to worry about sqft as long as the girths are full size. It seems I have to spit out my gum if I try to understand all that anyway:oops:
 
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Seth

Sustaining Partner
ARGHH-I feel so responsible!!!!

For so many headaches!!:oops:

My guess is that the Doyle guys, just like I did, made the assumption that it would kiss or just overlap the backstay-since this is usually the case with max girth mains on boats of similar A/R. But it is not always the case. Unless we have the actual backstay crane length and distance from the gooseneck to the backstay, we can't predict this accurately-this is a dimenision sailmakers always hope to get, but often it is not practical.

I can tell you that it is not possible for 2 sails being both a max girth to be different in their distance to the backstay-unless one is hoisted shorter than the other.

So, you are 100% right, that "it is what it is", and that if the P and E are correct, and the girths are at the limits allowed, do NOT worry about published sail area #'s-it HAS to be full size, and if two mains with these design/build parameters are laid against each other, they will be the same-for all practical purposes.

You did hit on one relevant factor-if you take 2 of these full sized sails, and one of them is installed on bat cars and the other is on standard, normal luff slides, the sail on the bat cars will of course poke out farther towards the backstay-since it is set back from the mast by the size of the cars..

I'm so sorry for causing confusion by making a generalization about the whole backstay thing-Tylenols for everyone on Seth!!;)

Also, glad the main seems to have the full range of adjustment-LOVE the PBO backstay-THAT is hightech!!
cheers,

Seth
 
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