Purchasing a 1987 38-200: The Refit Begins!

[Drewm3i]

New to the forum! Sea trial tomorrow, survey Monday! We are a young couple with ambitions of sailing the world. After looking at 15 boats (new and old), we found an immaculate 38-200 for sale. New to sailing, though we've owned five power boats from 20' to 30', including a Sea Ray that I just rebuilt structurally. We are very mechanically inclined and fit and are going to simply dive straight in. I will update this thread as we go along. We are located in South Florida presently.

The refit will consist of bottom paint, a compound, standing rig, running rig, new electronics, solar panels/wind gen, and anything else that comes up!

Cheers

 

[Christian Williams]

If you would like commentary on the candidate yacht, post the public listing here.

Good luck, and a prospective "welcome aboard!".

 

[Drewm3i]

https://m.sailboatlistings.com/view/67152

 

[Christian Williams]

Looks nice overall. No age (year of purchase) listed for sails or batteries.

The shoal draft keel is good for Florida and the Bahamas. There is a deep keel version also available. That will be a decision regarding world cruising vs. local.

 

[Joliba]

The keels on Ericson 38s are confusing. This article discusses the issue, but is not accurate:
http://www.boatus.com/boatreviews_bak/sail/Ericson38.asp
Mine is a 1988 E38-200 actually built in 1987. Though constructed prior to the Pacific Seacraft era, she has a 5’3” draft wing keel. I would agree that the deep draft fin keel version would be preferable for world cruising. As I’m sure you are aware from your power boating experience, all boats are compromises. So, you’ll need to prioritize what is most important for you. As for the boat you are considering, other refit items you would likely address would be larger anchors, better ground tackle, a windlass, cooking fuel conversion (CNG is not readily available around the world), a third reef in the main (or trysail) and a storm jib, a self steering windvane, and perhaps a water maker. The autopilot is the same as mine and is inadequate in moderate to heavy conditions. How old is the engine? I presume the original was a Universal 5432 as was common in Ericson 38s of that age. There are many more things you will likely address before setting off.
That said, I think that the Ericson 38-200 is a great boat. Many have cruised in the world and some have even circumnavigated.
Good luck
Mike Jacker

 

[u079721]

You've come to the right place for opinions and advice! From the write up that does look promising. Agree that you'll want to replace that ST-4000 AP, and you'll want to switch from CNG to propane for the stove fuel. CNG is great but way too hard to find.

Let the fun begin!

 

[Drewm3i]

Hey guys, sweet feedback!

Christian, I came across your videos on youtube and I have to say thank you for turning me onto the Ericson 38 train . We began looking at newer boats, planning to finance, but ended up deciding to pay cash.

Had the survey today and overall it went very well! The surveyors complemented the build quality of the boat, stating that they "don't build them like this anymore," lamenting newer production boats. He candidly told me that he doesn't say so much, but that he would "take the Ericson 38 anywhere."

The boat is in remarkable shape overall I would say! Overall, the cabin is near mint with no mold, mildew, and pristine original teak and cushions. The hull is in good shape, albeit with some blistering which the surveyors weren't too worried about. The grid looks very good with thick tabbing. One area near the forward bulkhead had cracked/broken tabbing, but I will simply re-tab. The tie-rods look good. The rig is in remarkable shape being 31 years old, but will be replaced! The paint in the compartments was flaking and will need to be repainted. The mast is in good shape, but will get a paint job. The hull is chalky and will get a buff. The topsides will probably be painted as the white paint/gel? has worn away. The rudder and keel were in excellent condition with no major dings. The running rigging is fair. The rudder had no play and rotated smoothly! The winches need to be serviced, but are very robust! The main sail is fair. The 135 head sail is good. The boat also comes with a dacron 155 and a mylar 155 and 175. The boat has a asymetrical as well! I will put some of the extra ones up for sale, no pun intended . The deck is solid, minus the anchor locker which I will probably need to re-core? I am very experienced with fiberglass and recently rebuilt a 30' power boat's stringers, bulkhead, and transom. The surveyor noted some elevated moisture levels on the deck, but without drilling holes to test, I don't really trust the readings. The surveyors said the deck is fine to them and they see no reason to address anything. The boat was recently struck by lightning so all of the electronics were fried. We are going to pull the mast and do all of the work ourselves and pocket the difference. In the end, we will probably pay about 30k, as the insurance will pay the owner a large sum which he will transfer to us.

I will add more info as I think of it!

Overall I think we are getting a solid boat for a reasonable price!

 

[Drewm3i]

FYI, engine is a Yanmar in great shape.

Autohelm is going to be replaced by the me/insurance with an ev-100, as I plan to get a windvane with spare rudder down the road.

I plan to add a windlass soon as the chain locker under the anchor locker liner has plenty of room for chain!

I prefer shoal keel because we will be in Florida and the Bahamas for at least a while! Also, one can't be super picky when buying 30 year old boats!

Re: CNG vs LPG, we will see. That is not top priority right now.

Batteries are five years old.

Sails are mixed: main is original, jib is about 20 years old. This boat was well cared for though and used very gently!

 

[Drewm3i]

 

[Joliba]

A few more thoughts

The boat looks great and your refit projects sound exciting. As an owner of a sistership, I have a few additional thoughts for your consideration:
1. I use CNG with the identical stove/oven to yours. It works great and is safe, as it is lighter than air unlike propane. Some say the flame is not as hot, but the difference is not noticeable in practice. For maintenance, all that is needed is to have the cylinder tank inspected and stamped every 10 years. Now, I fill the tank myself at a CNG station for trucks and cars using an adapter I bought on Ebay. It is simple and fills to 3000 PSI in seconds at a cost of $2.40, which lasts us at least 2 seasons. Unfortunately, this gas is hard to find in much of the world.
2. Concerning the lightning strike, I have known of 2 sailboats that had the deck coring burned out into large hollow areas by lightning. I know that your surveyor said that the deck is fine. But, I would suggest that you tap the deck all over with a plastic mallet (or something similar) and also open up all of the headliner zippers in the cabin that you can, to visually inspect what you can see. You may have already done this, but not all people are aware of that aspect of often hidden lightning damage.
3. For live aboard extended cruising, I think that the EV-100, though "smarter" than the ST-4000, will be insufficient in power to handle many situations you will find. Since you are spending the money for a new system and are inclined to do the work yourself, you may think about a below deck system that is more powerful, as the EV-100 is sometimes beyond its limit with a boat this size. Ryan L. and Nicole made an excellent installation in NAOMA, their 38-200 that has served them well as liveaboards for several years. Here is a post on the forum detailing their installation:
http://www.ericsonyachts.org/infoexchange/showthread.php?12103-38-200-Below-Deck-Linear-Drive-Installation-Pics-and-Information-(Autopilot)

 

[Christian Williams]

I like Ryan's installation, too.

But this owner intends a (Monitor) wind vane and spare rudder, so the EV-100 is a good complement to that. It is only used when motoring or under 15 knots of wind.

Oddly, it is probably cheaper to go with the belowdecks autopilot--even including the need for solar panels.

And it should be said that wind vanes are only for long passages, they are far too much work and clutter for daysailing. Therefore a real autopilot, all around, probably makes the most sense.

 

[Joliba]

Christian,
I agree. There is certainly nothing wrong with an EV–100. I intend to get one myself sometime soon.
(Ryan does have a Monitor vane, as well as his below deck auto pilot. His is probably the most robust complementary combination for all self-steering conditions.)
Mike

 

[Drewm3i]

I came across the CPT autopilot, which looks very robust, even rivaling a below deck unit! It has over 4x the torque power of the raymarine unit and is about the same price! Looks like a potential winner:

http://www.cptautopilot.com/features.php

I am very handy and don't mind projects, however I will need something that is plug and play for the next two years of coastal sailing, as I will be occupied with other projects and actually using the boat!

 

[csoule13]

Drew, if you'd like to see what the CPT is capable of, you can check out DrakeParagon on youtube. We's got a Westsail 40something he's taken from the US east coast up to Canada and then across the Atlantic to northern Europe. His videos have routinely mentioned his love of the CPT.

 

[Shawn Rodel]

Purchasing a 1988 38-200

New to forum also. We just finished the sea trial and Survey 8/15, all went well, take delivery on Sat. 8/26. Boat is in great shape, we plain on a lot of cleaning and upgrades I will post pic's and info soon. love the boat....Shawn

New to the forum! Sea trial tomorrow, survey Monday! We are a young couple with ambitions of sailing the world. After looking at 15 boats (new and old), we found an immaculate 38-200 for sale. New to sailing, though we've owned five power boats from 20' to 30', including a Sea Ray that I just rebuilt structurally. We are very mechanically inclined and fit and are going to simply dive straight in. I will update this thread as we go along. We are located in South Florida presently.

The refit will consist of bottom paint, a compound, standing rig, running rig, new electronics, solar panels/wind gen, and anything else that comes up!

Cheers

 

[Drewm3i]

A question for the Brain trust here: do you know if the e38-200's topsides were painted or gelcoat do from the factory? In some spots, the white has faded and the beige gelcoat of which the non skid consists, is poking through.

If it is gel, I could apply more in these areas before polishing. If it is paint, I will have to repaint.

 

[bgary]

Factory was gelcoat.

If it's been painted, it was painted sometime since it was new.

 

[Loren Beach]

A question for the Brain trust here: do you know if the e38-200's topsides were painted or gelcoat do from the factory? In some spots, the white has faded and the beige gelcoat of which the non skid consists, is poking through.

If it is gel, I could apply more in these areas before polishing. If it is paint, I will have to repaint.

As the original surface layer of gel coat is worn away by UV, over the decades the next layer down will show. Often a dark color, but sometimes the contrasting color shows.

Things could be worse.... a couple of years ago we looked at an early 80's E-38 where the owner had repainted the deck. With a broom. Or something like a broom. Without removing the hardware first.
Yeah really.....

 

[Christian Williams]

the white has faded and the beige gelcoat of which the non skid consists, is poking through.

On my boat the non-skid deck is painted beige, as further non-skid.

 

[Drewm3i]

Here is a picture:
See the beige poking through. It is like this in a lot of spots. I think adding more gel, sanding, buffing, and polishing is the way to go.